Happy Olympic and Paralympic year! Milano Cortina 2026 is only a few weeks away, and it’s time for National Olympic Committees to start naming their teams.
In figure skating, you can get a feel for which athletes will go to the Games by looking at the Grand Prix finale, the competition that ends the fall portion of the figure skating season. (Not Olympic Champion) Sarah Hughes of The Runthrough podcast joins us to talk about how the Grand Prix season and finale went down so that we can preview the figure skating competition for Milano Cortina 2026. Who’s likely to be on the podium for the pairs, ice dance, men’s and women’s events?
Listen to The Runthrough, which also features Olympians Ashley Wagner and Adam Rippon, on YouTube or your podcast app. They’re also a great follow on Insta.
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TRANSCRIPT
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424-Milano Cortina 2026: Olympic Figure Skating Preview with Sarah Hughes
Theme Music
Jill Jaracz: Hello, and welcome to another episode of Keep the Flame Alive, the podcast for fans of the Olympics and Paralympics.
If you love the games, we are the show for you. I am your host, Jill Jaracz, joined as always by my lovely co-host, Alison Brown. Alison, hello, happy Olympic and Paralympic year. How are you?
Alison Brown: I’m so excited. I spared you this year because in, in our New Year’s show passed, I had noisemakers, but I, I have spared you that, but I’ll just [00:01:00] say
Jill Jaracz: it is so exciting. I cannot believe they are like, just a couple weeks away.
Alison Brown: I know we are now in the month. Where you’re leaving.
Jill Jaracz: Yes. And that’s really bizarre. I got, I got a run. Are you ready? No, absolutely not. No. and we have talked about how the Italians will say, yeah, yeah, we’re getting it done, we’re getting it done.
And all of a sudden there’s like the last minute scramble. I really feel like that has set the tone in my own life of prep, preparing for these games.
Alison Brown: There’s gonna be a lot being very, like they were in Tokyo. Everything was all set and ready to go, you know, months ahead of time. That is not us.
Jill Jaracz: No, not, not this time around.
We, I feel like I’m flying by the seat of my pants.
Alison Brown: I know there’s a lot of lists. Yes, there’s a lot of notes. Apps. Yes. There’s a lot of fingers crossed. that too. And that’s just by the [00:02:00] organizers. That’s not even us,
Jill Jaracz: but I could tell you that’s all in my life as well. There’s gonna be a lot of praying that Italian th osmosis works. You never know, but we are kicking off the year.
Sarah Hughes on Figure Skating ahead of Milano Cortina 2026
Jill Jaracz: It’s, it’s New Year’s Day as this episode airs. So we are gonna kick off the year with figure skating this is the time when many National Olympic committees are in the midst of picking their teams. So we are previewing the probable competition with Sarah Hughes. Sarah is. Not the Olympic champion, Sarah Hughes and along with Olympians, Ashley Wagner and Adam Rappon. She hosts the Figure Skating Podcast, the run through, and for the last 12 years, she has worked at NBC Sports on the research and production side, including some Olympic figure skating assignments.
Alison Brown: So we, lemme tell you, she has forgotten more about figure skating than I have ever known. This woman’s encyclopedic knowledge is the only thing I knew more is stuff [00:03:00] because I’m older than she is, right? Like the stuff that I remember that she wasn’t born yet for. Otherwise, this woman knows it all.
Jill Jaracz: I know it’s fantastic.
We talked with Sarah on December 8th, just after the Grand Prix final to get a read on what we can look forward to at Milano Cortina 2026. Take a listen.
Alison Brown: Not Olympic champion. Sarah Hughes, thank you so much for joining us.
Sarah Hughes: Thank you. Yeah. Um, every time I start a new podcast recording of any kind, I’m reminded that I still have not won an Olympic gold medal. So it’s, it’s a thrill to be introduced by my mediocrity. Thank you for having me.
Alison Brown: But you are among friends.
We have not won an Olympic medal either. No. I
Sarah Hughes: mean, look, most people haven’t is kind of where I’ve ended up is I’m in the majority, you know what I mean? So it’s all good. Thank you. Yes,
Jill Jaracz: I’m excited. But you have NBC sports experience at the I do Olympics. I do. So you you are close to, you are close to that.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah. [00:04:00] Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I, yes, working the Olympics is almost like winning them. That’s what I always say. It is
Jill Jaracz: exhausting. I’ll say that.
Sarah Hughes: I would say it might be more exhausting, I don’t know, maybe not as emotionally exhausting, but the physical toll of working the Olympics on the TV side is, um, it’s hard to describe.
You just run on adrenaline the whole time. And then if you’re me, you get sick immediately the day after it’s over. You do, your whole body just crashes
Alison Brown: or, or if you’re like, Jill and I, you get sick during Paris.
Sarah Hughes: Oh no. I mean, it’s hard. It’s hard to like be pushing through and not sleeping and you’re on your feet all the time.
You know? And if, I don’t know what you guys were doing there, but if you’re going venue to venue, like it’s exhausting. You know
Sarah Hughes’ career in TV production
Jill Jaracz: In terms of TV production, I know you’ve done some research. Mm-hmm. You’ve been a researcher, but what else have you done in terms of TV production?
Sarah Hughes: I have done a lot of different things.
I won’t bore you with my entire resume, but in terms of [00:05:00] Olympics specifically, Yes, I was an Olympics researcher for quite a long time at NBC, , which, sort of entails interviewing athletes and gathering information about rules and competition format and, things like that to help our production teams plan for broadcasting the Olympics.
and then, I also kind of eventually evolved, into a sort of talent producer slash producer role, that I played that role primarily on gymnastics in the summer and figure skating in the winter. I was on figure skating for a long time first, and then, they had, they needed someone to do gymnastics and I think they thought, well, it’s a judge sport, Sarah can do it.
And so I kind of had to learn that one, uh, on the go. And then I’ve, so I’ve done a lot of different things. I’ve done some like co-producing, I’ve done some talent specific producing. Um, I’ve done research, I’ve done actual live line producing. I produced rhythmic gymnastics last [00:06:00] summer in Paris.
so, I’ve done a bunch of different things and it’s fun. I, I’m gonna be working on Gold Zone for Milan, so if you’re familiar with the Gold Zone experience, uh, we debuted, uh, it’s in the style of NFL Red Zone, you have basically a quad box and we can show, you know, a bunch of different events happening at once.
And we actually have the host of NFL Red Zone that comes and hosts Gold Zone. Um, and we jump around to different metal events and, you know, we’ll put. If something really exciting is happening in one specific event, we’ll go full screen to that and then we’ll jump back around to something else. So that’s what I’m gonna be doing for Milan.
And yeah, so, so I’ve done a lot of different things and that was a long-winded way of telling you that
Jill Jaracz: that’s okay. We like to go deep.
How The Runthrough came to be
Alison Brown: So you do the amazing. Podcast, the run through with Ashley Wagner and Adam Ripon. How did that come to be?
Sarah Hughes: You know, it was Ashley’s idea. you know, she gets credit for sure for the conception of, you know, what [00:07:00] she did was she wanted to do a podcast with Adam, or like a YouTube show basically.
And they asked me if I would kind of help them produce it and, you know, so I thought, yeah, great. and they said, you know, you should just get on the recordings with us. And it can be like one of those where every once in a while, like the producer chimes in and you can be sort of just like, you know, sort of like you’re watching.
You know, on late night comedy shows where the host always has this guy on the side that occasionally he has chime in. Like that was sort of, I think what the vision was for all of us originally. And then over time I just started, we started sharing, talking more on it. I started talking more on it and just sort of became a third host.
I still do a lot of the editing and producing for the show, but so do they, it it sort of merged into this sort of three way, like we all, equally do hosting and Adam and I do a lot of the editing together, you know what I mean? So it just sort of evolved like [00:08:00] that. But it was Ashley’s idea to do something with Adam and they wanted my help because of my production experience.
And it turned out that it just. We liked the banter and the rhythm of the show with three people a little bit more than with two. and we started it in a year when Ashley was pregnant, and so she needed to eventually go on a maternity leave. So then I really had to be talking. so I had to kind of come out of the back seat.
and I mean, we just love doing it. We’ve, it’s very much a passion project. Like, you know, I, I don’t know how often you guys listen to it, but, you know, we don’t do any ads on the show or anything. Like, we are just, we’re just vibing, you know what I mean? Like, I just feel like I’m getting on the phone to talk to my friends about something we all really like, and it’s been such a fun thing.
and it’s been great to just, I feel so connected with fans, and with skaters to some degree. You know, I know that some of the skaters are listening to it, and I [00:09:00] feel like we just like, really. Have sort of this little community that came out of doing this show because people love, you know, the inside jokes and they get repeated and they get put on, you know, people’s mixed t-shirts and whatever.
And it’s just, it’s been so much fun. It’s awesome.
Alison Brown: Well, it’s been a lot of fun to listen to.
Jill Jaracz: Thank you. Thank you. Thank
Alison Brown: So for today, we wanna go, so when we’re recording this, the Grand Prix season’s done, but nobody’s been named their Olympic team.
So just as depending on when we are the episode, but we wanna go through discipline by discipline and just kind of see where we are at this point.
Sarah Hughes: Sure.
Previewing the pairs Olympic figure skating competition at Milano Cortina 2026
Alison Brown: So let’s start with pairs.
Sarah Hughes: Okay. Let’s start with pairs. I didn’t know where you were gonna go.
Alison Brown: Uh, yeah, no, we’re gonna start with kind of, I
Sarah Hughes: don’t wanna say the least. Interesting. I think I would, I would fight you on that. because I, I actually think pairs got very interesting to me this fall. Um, more so than it has been in the last few seasons. I mean, [00:10:00] pairs is certainly, I mean, I’m American obviously, like pairs is certainly the discipline that the Americans are the least involved in, in terms of being contenders.
But I think that the discipline itself is quite interesting. the Grand Prix final, just so for people who don’t really follow figure skating closely, the figure skating season is essentially divided into two halves. The fall and then the post fall. I, I don’t wanna call it the spring, ’cause a lot of it happens in winter, but basically from, you know, October to December, there’s a series of international events that are called Grand Prix events.
There’s six events that skaters go to a maximum of two. They get assigned those of the events that they’re going to, and you earn points based on your placements at your Grand Prix, your two Grand Prix, and then the top six point earners go to the Grand Prix final, which just happened this weekend.
Historically, the Grand Prix final is the very best indicator. Of what is going to happen at the [00:11:00] Olympics or at the World Championships in the same season? because it, on the regular Grand Prix early in the season, you typically, they intentionally seed it so that the top skaters don’t go against each other right away.
So the Grand Prix final is usually the first time we see the very best skaters up against each other. And so the Grand Prix final is easily my favorite event of the year. It’s compact. It’s high stakes. It’s really interesting. Predictive, you learn a lot. I think you learn a lot about the skaters. I learn a lot every year about my own taste where once I’m seeing all the skaters back to back to back, I sometime, like my opinions will change on what I thought of the programs.
Now that I’m seeing it next to that other program, like I feel like that happens to me every year where I have a change of heart about somebody or someone’s program or whatever it is. So. That’s the setup of what the Grand Prix final is. Yeah.
Alison Brown: I’m thinking we [00:12:00] have four pairs with podium potential.
Sarah Hughes: I would tell you we probably have six.
Okay. so. the way that the Grand Prix final went, um, was Reup Mira and Rio Chi Kihara from Japan won somewhat controversially within the skating world. they made a couple mistakes in their free skate and in their, they had a little mistake in their short program too. Um, and Sarah Con and Nicolo Macci from Italy got second and they were clean, completely clean in both programs.
So there was, you know, those, there was talk about should, should they have won the event? I think it’s, it’s, you’re splitting hairs with these teams because they’re both really, really good. Um, and the thing that I about is that this Grand Prix final took place in Nagoya, Japan. And the Olympics will take place in Milan, Italy.
And you’re talking about a Japanese team and an Italian team who are really close. and so I don’t, you [00:13:00] know, I feel for Sarah and Nikola like for this weekend, because I’m sure they feel like, man, like what more can we do? They did two incredible programs, but I could see this result flipping, in Milan.
That being said, there’s a German team, Minerva Haa and Nikita Velo who got third here, but they got third in part because of a big mistake in their short program. They won the free skate. Like, and so they, I think with two clean programs can easily and should easily be on this podium and could win. they are probably the most.
Textbook team that we see in terms of actual figure skating pairs, elements. You know, they look like, I always say to, to Adam, you know, they look like they are doing the AI version of an element that you would show somebody is like, this is how it should look. Right. That you would put in the judging, you know, teacher’s thing to show a judge this is a perfect element.
Like a lot of their pair elements are like that. I think [00:14:00] they’re a little less developed on their artistic side and so sometimes they don’t make as big of an emotional impact, which is part of your score of course. But if they do two clean programs, I mean, they didn’t do two clean programs here and they were four points off the lead.
So if they do two clean programs, I mean they can win the Olympic gold medal. Deanna St. Eck and Max Damp from Canada are world champions from a year and a half ago. Um, I mean, it’ll be two years once we get to Milan, but. I mean, they always have a chance to me because they are really emotionally impactful.
They have an amazing, very intense short program to Carmina Bana. It’s crazy. She does a back flip. and so they’re great. They, they’ve had some struggles this season just like being consistent. So I think they have the potential to be on it. They’re trending in the wrong direction, but they still have the potential.
And then we also can’t forget that a team that was not even here, sway and Han who won the last Olympics, they were the first ones [00:15:00] out for Grand Prix final qualification. But I don’t think of that as really being disqualifying when you’re talking about Sway and Han, because they just came back to competition this fall.
So they’re sort of like. Getting warmed up, you know what I mean? So I wouldn’t put it past them, you know, they don’t go to the Grand Prix final, they take a couple months to really train and get into the right kind of shape. Before Milan, I would not be surprised if they show up in Milan and they’re right there in the podium mix again.
I mean, they are, I mean, one of the best teams, that we’ve ever seen, certainly in this century. And you know, so, so you can never really count them out. And then there’s a Georgian team, Mattel and Alva, who got fourth at the Grand Prix final just now. And they, they also kind of like Minerva and Nikita from Germany.
Are really excellent on like the actual elements, the pair elements. And so when they’re clean, which is an if that’s an if, but when they’re clean, they’re very impressive too. And pairs is a volatile event, right? [00:16:00] Because it’s, it’s these like really big acrobatic throws and lifts and twists and jumps. And so typically you’re not gonna see all six of the teams I just said Go clean.
It’s gonna come down to who skates the best is. And that’s really exciting.
Jill Jaracz: So you mentioned back flips. Yeah. That is now legal. Yes. Do you know any reason why the ISU said, okay, it’s gonna be legal now.
Sarah Hughes: I honestly think that the ISU, a lot of their motivation for some of the different changes they’ve made over the past, call it six to eight years, is to try to modernize the sport and make it more spectator friendly.
so, an easy way to say that is a back flip is more likely to go viral than a spin. and, you know, it’s a cool feature and I think that the reason that they didn’t allow it, was primarily for, you know, safety. But I think they’ve sort of decided that, hey, like, you know, we need to put [00:17:00] that in the hands of the skaters and the coaches to know what, what risks, you know, they are willing to take, you know, obviously hoping that everybody is risking within reason and knowing that they’re gonna land something.
But, um, yeah, I, I really think it was just kind of to make it a little more fun for the audience.
Jill Jaracz: How do cartwheels on the ice then fit it? Because I’m not sure that’s more fun for the audience.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, I don’t know. The cartwheels on the ice is, it’s a contentious, it’s a contentious issue amongst skating purists. you know, it can be sort of a fun feature depending on the, like, tone of your program. I mean, if you’re doing something that’s like Estrada, which sort of has this almost carnival feel to it, then oh, okay.
Like, sure, a cartwheel, why not? But a lot of the time it feels a little out of place to me. But, the skaters can get, you know, some extra, grade of execution. You know, they can get [00:18:00] credit for like a difficult entry or exit into a spin if they sort of cartwheel into it, which we see a lot. So, um, yeah, I, I think, again, I think the ISU is interested in.
Just making skating something that is fun for audiences and cool for people to watch and, and something that kids wanna try too, you know, like for participation. And so I think some of those, like fun, cool, different elements that aren’t really like the pure skating. I think a lot of the motivation comes from that.
Alison Brown: Who do you think is gonna pull it off
Sarah Hughes: in the pair? Who do I think in the pair? I honestly, after this weekend, I think the Italian team is going to win the Olympics. I actually do, which is crazy. If you asked me a year ago, I would say they’re fighting for bronze. That’s like what I would’ve told you a year ago if you, if I had talked to you three years ago, I, I don’t know that I would’ve even said that, that, you know what I’m saying?
but they have come such a long way in their skating. I was so impressed with the way they skated at the Grand [00:19:00] Prix final this weekend. And I think if they skate like that in front of a home crowd at the, at an Olympics where Italy really, this is their very best medal chance. You know, I, I just think that probably ends up going their way.
If they can do that, if they can recreate that again, again with, it’s a big ish, I’m with
Alison Brown: you on I’m with you on that one. That’s the one where I’m like, Ooh, I want them to pull it off.
Sarah Hughes: I do too. I do too. I mean, it’s hard, like, you know, when you watch skating, like you get attached to all of them.
Right. I don’t wanna root against anybody, you know, I love all these, I’d be happy for any of these teams to win Olympic gold. And so, I mean, it’s, it’s tough, but I, yeah. If, if you made me predict something right now, that’s who I would take.
Previewing the ice dance Olympic figure skating competition at Milano Cortina 2026
Alison Brown: Okay. The, the discipline that defies all predictions. I dance
Sarah Hughes: Yeah.
Defies all predictions. And at the same time is the easiest predict, exactly the easiest one to predict sometimes.
Alison Brown: the first thing I wanna know is, is the ISU punking us [00:20:00] every time they pick a rhythm dance.
Sarah Hughes: Yes. Well, if you’re, if you are a skating purist,
Alison Brown: yes they are. I’m just doing without being a purist.
This, this one. The last year teams, I thought teams did a great job making those, that theme work.
Jill Jaracz: Wait, last year was, what theme?
Alison Brown: Last year was 50 sixties, seventies dance, uh, social dances.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, so they, they had a broader, this year it’s nineties specifically and last, yeah, last year they had a, like wider range of decades they could use, which I thought was better because not everyone should be doing nineties programs that doesn’t suit everybody’s strengths, right?
And so when you force them all into one decade, there’s just a lot less variety of music that is in one decade than is in three or four decades like we saw last year. And so it doesn’t allow [00:21:00] for us to see as broad of a range of expression for the different teams that are very different and have really different strengths.
and they also have really emphasized with the nineties theme that it’s sort of like dance party and they want it to be really fast and they want it to be. You know, like they want the tempo to be up, up, up. And that can be kind of grading over time. Like you watch that over and over and over again.
You eventually feel like you’ve been watching the same program, you know, for an hour. and, and in some cases you really have, you’ve seen like six Backstreet Boys programs in some cases. You know what I mean?
Jill Jaracz: did anyone choose the Macarena?
Sarah Hughes: Not that I can think of. There’s a long list of nineties music that went unchosen and it’s devastating.
Alison Brown: I also question a lot of the fashion choices with this because clearly you can tell that nobody who was alive in the nineties. Was involved in [00:22:00] these
Sarah Hughes: choices. You can tell who was alive and who wasn’t. I’ll say that. I’ll say that and I will say that about the costumes and about the skating. you know what I mean?
Sometimes I don’t mean that as a good thing, sometimes the music feels like too fast and almost like too young. For some of the teams that do have more like artistic maturity, it’s weird to watch them try to almost like juvenile themselves up to do this dance party thing. So are we being punked?
I hope so. If that means that Ashton Kutcher’s gonna come out and tell me the theme is changing.
Alison Brown: are chalk and Bates from the US still the favorites?
Sarah Hughes: That is a good question.
Alison Brown: GU Cerone, the reigning, gold medalist Comes back this season, new partner.
And has kind of been tearing up the rule book in terms of waiting his turn, as you can see, an ice dance.
Sarah Hughes: you know, I don’t think that people who have won the [00:23:00] Olympics have to abide by, wait your turn rules.
I really don’t, I don’t think you should have to, and, and Guillaume is possibly the best male ice dancer we’ve ever seen. truly, I mean, he’s the best skater in the world, period. and Lauren is not far behind him, his new partner, um, which is remarkable. it’s remarkable that Guillaume has somehow found two different partners in this life that match him so well and are so talented.
but yeah, to your point. the rest of the teams going through this Olympic quad kind of had their hierarchy mostly figured out. And the reentry of Guillaume with Laurenz completely disrupts that hierarchy. and it, it disrupts it, not because he’s being unfairly rewarded. It disrupts it because, like I just said, he is the best skater out there.
and they are the best skaters, like, and we’re talking about pure skating skills. They are the best skaters in [00:24:00] the world right now, I believe. That being said, ice dance is not a skating skills competition only. Right. It’s it’s performance, right? It’s performance, it’s acrobatics, it’s creativity, you know, it’s, it’s leaning into the things that you are really good at.
And Maddie and Evan have done a great job of finding the lane that works for them and they are also great skaters. Right. I’m not sitting here being like everybody else is bad and Guillaume is good. Everybody is very, is very good. I think he’s better. And I think Laurence is, is, incredible as well.
but I think you end up sort of in this, okay, what are they going to do? Because you have this team, chalk and Bates who have won three straight world titles, who do a great job. I don’t wanna say like appeasing the judges, but I think they, they are really good about. Making adjustments to their programs throughout the season to follow the feedback that they’re getting from judges and officials.
And [00:25:00] so they are really good at, playing the game essentially. and while they do that, staying true to a vision and they’re, you know, Maddie in particular is a great performer. You know, they really suck you in. They are like really fun to watch. and so I think it’s gonna be close. I, I, I think it’s gonna be really close.
Lauren and Guillaume got second at the Grand Prix final, but they had some mistakes here that, uh, one of them, you know, Laurent’s, like her skate just got caught on her dress and she fell, which is incredibly fluky and unusual and, you know, that’s not something you count on happening. I think Maddie and Evan are the only team that can beat Lauren and Guillaume.
I just don’t, I don’t know if they will when it comes down to it or not, they did this weekend, but I’m frustrated because going into this Grand Prix final, I said on our podcast when we were previewing it, I said, the thing that I don’t want is for there to be big mistakes because then we won’t really know how the judges feel about [00:26:00] these teams.
And so, you know, you watch Lauren and Guillaume get second with big mistakes, so you don’t really know what that means. Would the lack of mistakes have made up the deficit? I don’t, I don’t know. I think it would’ve been really, really close and then it would’ve been just a complete toss up.
Alison Brown: you mentioned getting your skate caught in your skirt because Madison chalk skirt this season.
It is very long. Yeah. It makes me so angry. Like it is unreasonable how angry I am at this costume.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah. Yeah. She’s got her heels dug in a little bit about it, I think.
Alison Brown: Yeah. What is the scuttlebutt in the skating world about this? Are other people as upset as I am? Or is it just my, my lack of, of finesse here?
Sarah Hughes: I certainly think other people are nervous for her for that to cost them. Absolutely. And you know, like. I hesitate to put this in the universe at all, but Maddie and Evan do not have the best track record at the Olympics specifically. [00:27:00] they took a devastating fall in their free dance eight years ago in Pyeongchang.
It was like, it was awful. and they have like, just had kind of fluky mistakes at the Olympics like that. And so I don’t, I just like, it makes me nervous to like invite that in at all if you’re them. Right. But Maddie designs their costumes. Yes. She designs a lot of other people’s costumes and she has a vision for what this should look like and what it should be.
And she’s, you know, they’re practicing with that skirt on. She has like a practice version of the skirt and, who am I to tell them that they can’t do it? Right. I, I don’t think, and you know what’s funny is, Way back, way back in 2010. Tessa Virtue had a skirt that was quite long, and people were all like, oh, no.
Like, you know, like, don’t do that. This is like something bad is gonna happen. And then she won the Olympics. So, you know, there’s a precedent for this kind of thing, and I hope that it works out for Maddie the way that it worked out for Tessa. but yeah, I, I [00:28:00] feel your pain watching it. It’s scary. And,
Jill Jaracz: and to take a step back and also touch on something I wanted to ask.
I, like I stance because they do have the wacky programs mm-hmm. And they have wacky themes. And Chuck and Bates are doing a Matador and bull program, correct? They are, yes. So she is dressed, she’s the bull and she’s, she’s the Matador. Yes. With a high low skirt. That is supposed to be the cape, correct?
Yes.
Sarah Hughes: So that he, the bowl charges at the, at the cape is sort of the, that’s the running theme and the reason that the skirt is needed to complete the, the vision. But it’s scary. It’s scary. I get it. Do
Jill Jaracz: we have other unique visions in ice dance this cycle?
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, I mean, so, I think that Piper Gillis and Paul Poirier, who are from Canada, who have been on the world podium several times over, um, and who are definitely [00:29:00] in the podium mix for Milan, have always had a really.
Clear artistic vision of what they wanna do. And it’s usually off the beaten path a little bit. they don’t do a lot of, call it like traditionally romantic programs, which a lot of ice dance is, you know, we see people do Romeo and Juliet or, you know, even, I could even argue the Matador in the bull is kind of just a play on a romantic program in some ways.
You know what I’m saying? So Piper and Paul have, have never really conformed to that and they have brought back a free dance. This year called Vincent, which I don’t know that I’d call it wacky. It’s not, it’s actually very beautiful. but I think it’s really unique, which is nice. it’s different than the types of, of programs we see a lot.
And then, you know, at this Grand Prix final, a team from Lithuania, Alison Rein, cellulose, Amber Levits, they have a wacky free dance that is like, sort of, I use the wordy a lot to like [00:30:00] describe some of the things that skaters do, but they have sort of like. It, they’re doing God as a dj, I don’t know if you know that song, but it’s, it’s like, it’s just this sort of like weird techno e program that you’re just like, okay, sure.
’cause it works for them, you know? So you just, you’re like, all right, let’s just, I’m just gonna let that go, I guess. and so yeah, I mean there, there’s always people who are doing things that are really out there in ice dance. I think there’s actually some really void fun out there programs in the singles disciplines this year.
but yeah, I’d probably single out Allison and Silas as free dance as being like the void, one of the top group for sure.
What “the void” is in figure skating
Jill Jaracz: And for our listeners who aren’t aware what the void is, what, what is the void,
Sarah Hughes: you know, what your guess is as good as mine. I know I made this term up. I, I, yeah. So I made up a term, I sort of made up a.
you know, my friends started calling programs void e before I did. I picked it up from them and then I kind of like [00:31:00] translated that into, you know what, like we have some skaters who are like children of the void. I think of the void as this weird dark abyss where, I don’t know, the like weirdos are celebrated and live and they come out to, you know, show their, their weird specific weirdness.
Um, you know what I mean? I don’t know. I’m, I that’s, that’s, kind of how I think of it. It’s like it’s, it’s this sort of like swirling black hole that just like the most kind of creative, unique ideas come out of. and the skaters who are sort of just doing, doing something that’s not very traditional.
So
Alison Brown: there’s no Romeo and Juliet in the void?
Sarah Hughes: No. No, there’s not.
2025 figure skating comebacks
Jill Jaracz: Here in the US there was a big bruhaha hullabaloo about the Shiba coming back.
Sarah Hughes: There was,
Jill Jaracz: well, I think NBC has pushed them forward and, you know, they got a few, uh, sponsorship deals. Yeah.
Sarah Hughes: I mean the, [00:32:00] the Shivas are, I don’t know what to think of what’s gonna happen at National. So the, I mean, I’m sure you’ve covered this already, but the, you know, the US team will be picked in about a month at the US championships at the, you know, the first week of January and.
Two US ice dance teams just competed at the Grand Prix final. chalk and Bates, obviously who won it. And then Emily is IGN Zingus and Vadim Knick. And I think because of their success on the Grand Prix this season and having qualified for such a prestigious event as the final, I feel pretty good that those two spots are pretty solidly theirs.
And so that leaves one spot and three teams. In my mind competing for that one spot. and the shibas are, are sort of a wild card because they’re, you know, just started competing again on the Grand Prix six weeks ago and they’ve [00:33:00] competed twice. Um, and their, you know, their scores did go up. they took feedback on their programs after the first time they brought them out and they made changes and adjustments and they have, a brilliant coach Maria Eva, who has been, you know, hugely successful in ice dance over the years.
so I, I really don’t feel comfortable ever counting them out because they, you know, like I was saying about playing the game. The Shibas really know how to play it. they always did when they were, you know, actively competing back in the, the earlier quads. but you look at, you know, the other two teams, Christina Carrera, Anthony Ponko, and Caroline Green and Michael Parsons, who have been grinding away while the Shibas have not been competing.
And you think about this sort of like, wait, your turn thing and are the shibas special enough? Is there material special enough this year blowing you away, kind of thing to jump that line the way we talked about [00:34:00] Guillaume and Laurent’s doing, right. I don’t know. They are doing an old program that they, you know, that they did many years ago.
A reworked version of Fix You by Coldplay. I don’t know if. That will be rewarded as much as, as teams who have, you know, been trying to do, like, you know what, Carolyn and Michael have a really void e free dance. I forgot about them when we were talking about that. They have such a void, e free dance.
but you know, like these teams who are really trying to, to be creative and to, you know, and change and you know, the other thing is that I, stance has changed a lot since the Shibas last competed. A lot of the elements that are required are new since they last competed. or they’re reworked in a different way or they have different requirements to get the high levels that you need.
And so I think the Schibs are really playing a lot of catch up here. But if you’re seeing a trend of your Caroline and Michaels or your Christina and Anthony’s [00:35:00] having inconsistencies or getting low scores and you’re seeing the, she’s. Even though they’re still a little bit freshly back, if you see them trending in the opposite direction, you know, you could see a committee making a calculated risk that you think the shibas will, you know, would ultimately score better, place better than those other two teams in an Olympic field.
I don’t know. and, and you know, like it’s not all discretionary like that, you know, there’s a mathematical component to the way they, give out these spots that, takes into account all your competitions for the last year. The SHIs do get some credit for having been Olympic medalists last time they were competing.
but they don’t have any of the points from most of the last year. You know, they’ve competed twice on the Grand Prix. They weren’t at the World Championships last year. They weren’t in nationals last year. So they are really in like a, a catch up. I do wonder if they, if they make it close enough and they’re able to beat those [00:36:00] other two teams at nationals, if that sends them over the edge.
I don’t know. I know I’m giving you a very non-answer. I’m just sort of setting up the situation, but that’s like, I’m watching it along, as with everybody else, I don’t know what’s going to happen.
Jill Jaracz: Yeah, I mean, it’s really interesting that in the two disciplines we’ve talked about, we’ve had people coming back, you know, sway and Han have come back and not struggled, but you can see, oh, it’s not so easy to just decide.
Yeah, let’s, let’s flip the switch on and we’re gonna be great again. And, GUIs and Laurent, you know, at the beginning of the season listening to your podcast, they had some, you know, a little bit of work to do as well. Yeah. I mean, they weren’t that far removed from competition, but It’s interesting, you, you think, could I make a comeback? And, and you see how difficult it is in this world. Yes,
Sarah Hughes: yes. and pairs is a lot more, you know, with Sway and Han Pairs is a lot more physically demanding. Sway and Han were never a particularly healthy team when they were [00:37:00] competing more.
so, you know, I, I, I, I said to Ashley and Adam, I said, this might be better for them to just not be at the Grand Prix final and take some time to just stay healthy and train. instead of like trying to peak again for another competition. Like just, just peak for one, just go to the Olympics and see if it works out kind of thing.
ice dance is a little less physically demanding in that, you know, in the way that pairs is, but Yeah. But I still think you do see like how hard it is to adjust to, you know, it’s not that the shi botani can’t do the elements right. You can see the difference between a team that has been doing the elements for years on end.
There’s just a level of comfort there, that allows for greater speed, for greater flow, for better transitions. You know, the SHIs, if you said, Hey, go do a one foot step sequence, they can do it, but are they going to do it as fast as like, with as complex of transitions in and out of it, as a team that maybe, maybe is [00:38:00] less talented than them, I don’t know, but is like, has been doing it for three years in practice every day?
Probably not. And that has nothing to do with talent. That’s literally just, you know, it’s muscle memory, it’s practice, and you can’t recreate years of training. you either have the hours in or you don’t.
Previewing the men’s Olympic figure skating competition at Milano Cortina 2026
Jill Jaracz: Let’s move over to mens.
Alison Brown: Can anyone beat ia? Malina?
Sarah Hughes: No.
Alison Brown: Even if next question, I know it’s, oh, no know, I mean, question, how many times does he have to fall for somebody else to win?
Sarah Hughes: Hmm. Three. And then somebody else has to be their very best self. yeah, I mean, assuming he’s gonna do, you know, roughly the program plan that he did at the Grand Prix final? I mean, there’s just no, there’s no mathematical way. You know, at a certain point you like lose the math. Like I’m, I’m looking at these scores like i’s base value.
So that’s before you get points for artistry, it’s before you get additional points for, you know, your grade of execution [00:39:00] is 115 points roughly. Okay. Now, you know, for some people who don’t watch figure skating, that number doesn’t mean anything to you. But the next best person in this field, their base value is 93.
So, like, think about how many points that is, like 22 points difference just in the base before he gets rewarded for also executing everything very, very well. You know, because his, he starts at 115 base value. He ends up at 146 in technical. So, so you’re getting, he’s getting 30 more points in grade of execution.
Like he’s, he’s getting a score, a, like a 1 46 technical only score without the artistry added in that, compares to like the very best scores we see in women’s total. and so it’s just sort of an insurmountable, I. Hill to climb. If he lands all these jumps, he’s doing seven quads. We’ve never seen someone [00:40:00] do that before.
Um, and he’s doing them and making it look easy and he’s doing them cleanly, and there is no amount of performance value, artistic expression, great spins that can make up that gap for somebody else. They’re just not worth that. Those things just aren’t worth as many points as the jumps are, and that’s the way it’s
Jill Jaracz: If IA could be artistic, would that help his scores even more?
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, and you know what? I think that IA already gets very high artistic marks. again, I keep referencing sort of the skating purists, you know, you, like, you look at somebody like a Jason Brown, or a Yuma Kma from Japan who are, considered really like the true artists of the world right now in the men’s event.
It’s certainly different. It’s a different kind of artistry than what Ilya is doing. But you know, like the three artistry marks are skating skills, composition, and presentation. And you know, you think about the composition of a [00:41:00] program, you know, Ilya. Even though like, I don’t care for sometimes, like the way he’s kind of skating back and forth on the rink to just set up another quad, set up another quad, set up another quad.
He does take care to put elements on the music in places where they make sense. and you, you know, that is some of what composition is. And then presentation, I think Ilya is a good performer. I think he can suck you in as an audience member. And I don’t, you know, he does his type of quote unquote, his type of artistry is more like he has a style, right?
And it’s not classical style the way that someone like a Jason or a Yuma is, but it is like this sort of like avant-garde, modern style that suits him. And, you know, so I, I don’t think that he should be getting like, really low artistry scores. You know, I, is Yuma a better artist? Yeah, absolutely. But like I said.
Even if you [00:42:00] gave Ilya like half of what you gave Yuma, he would win. Ilya would win because the jumps are that much more valuable. So it sort of becomes a moot point a little bit. But yes, if he were a better artist, his scores would be better. But he doesn’t have that far to go. They are giving him very high artistry scores because you know, if you listen to someone, like my co-host, Adam would tell you that doing Seven Quads is a great performance in its own way.
Like he really believes that, that, you know, that should count for something that he is like bringing people to their feet, giving them chills because of the sheer athletic dominance. and so I think there’s, again, from a purist standpoint, he’s not the most artistic guy out there. He’s not doing the most complex skating skills or transitions because he’s gotta get all these jumps done.
But that’s the game, right? and, you know, he’s [00:43:00] maximizing what he does best, which is jumping. And other skaters try to maximize what they do best, whether it’s jump spins, step sequences, whatever. And again, the bottom line is that the jumps are the most valuable thing. So he wins.
Alison Brown: I know you’re a big fan of Caama.
Sarah Hughes: I am. It’s true. Yes. It’s like my son. I’m trying to adopt him. If he’s listening and he needs an additional parent. I know he has Carolina Costner, but I would take him into,
Alison Brown: so we’re just gonna put him in, in the silver medal spot for our predictions. Just, just for love also. Oh, we could
Sarah Hughes: look if, if Yuma skates cleanly, he should be the silver medalist.
I think his free skate is truly an artistic masterpiece. I really believe that. It’s one of the best programs I’ve ever seen. It emotionally moves me every time I watch it. choreographed by Lori Nichol, who’s like, one of the, the greatest [00:44:00] choreographers in skating history and has done some of the most iconic programs, you know, people I’ve ever seen from Michelle Kwan all the way to now.
and I mean, it’s, it’s genius. His program is genius. And if he does that cleanly, I don’t think anything should beat it except Ilya will because of the jumps. But, this is not an original thought from me, but it’s, you know, somebody pointed out online this weekend, Yuma is doing artistically what Ilya is doing.
Technically, he is pushing the bounds of what is sort of this like perfect ideal. Right. But one is worth more points than the other. So I would hope that if you must skates cleanly, which is an if, love him, it’s an if. but if he skates cleanly, I would hope that that wins out, you know, on the day that he creates a moment and that the judges see that this is kind of an artistic ideal that we should be rewarding.
and I, and I hope that he gets the [00:45:00] silver medal if that’s the case.
Alison Brown: And then we have a whole bunch of children of the void, I feel like. Yeah. In the men’s, in the men’s program. That is one of so true of my favorites. Mikel shutoff.
Sarah Hughes: Mikal Shider off. Yes.
Alison Brown: He’s so adorable. I just wanna put him in my pocket and take him home.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, he’s, he is, he is. I mean, and he’s, he’s such a nice guy. he. Is struggling a little this season though. yeah, he was silver medalist at Worlds last year. He just got sixth at the Grand Prix final out of six. so, I would say in the singles event, the Grand Prix final is a little less predictive in the sense that it really, you just have to skate clean.
And if you don’t, then it’s gonna mess you up at the Olympics. So it doesn’t matter. so, you know, I’m not putting Schneider Rob in a box that he’s off the podium. The men are the men, and the men are, you know, they’re gonna fall all over the place, you know, sometimes. And so they can be really up and down with like, who’s on the podium and who’s not.[00:46:00]
So I wouldn’t rule him out, but he is, yeah, Mikhail Ov has some extremely void weird programs, and has, you know, is, it seems to be kind of tinkering, to figure out, you know, what the right recipe is. He went back to his old short program just for this event. So he’s, he is ditched the new one that he came up with for this season.
but he has the weirdest free skate I’ve ever seen. I have no idea what it’s about. I, I’m just, I feel like I’m on an acid trip every time watching it, or I’m like, I don’t know what I’m watching. I don’t know what this is, what’s happening. but yeah, I love him. I mean, he’s, he’s awesome to watch.
I think he definitely has room to grow artistically. And, we talk about like him and Ilya, both men have room to grow artistically, but in figure skating, you know, you get rewarded over time for being consistent. And Schneider is a little less consistent than Ilia Malon is. And so IA over time has been able to build component scores, build, build, build.
Whereas now [00:47:00] he’s sort of just like, has sort of a baseline that’s pretty high because he’s a multi-time world champion and because he almost never misses. So that never hurts. But yeah, I, I’m a big fan of Meow Ovv. Adam Ow, him from France is a big fan favorite, like people love him, love his skating, he’s really emotive, um, and fun to watch.
And he can do a ton of quads. He has a back flip. Like he does a lot of the big kind of show stopping. Things, but has been a little inconsistent. But if, I mean, again, if he skates to clean programs, he’s gonna be right there because he’s got a lot of, he’s got a lot of quads in there. you know, I think he can do up to five in a program if he is, you know, in, in the right head space and, you know, skating well.
So again, it’s, it’s not ia, it’s not seven. but he can be right up there too, but he just, like Schneider OV has been a little bit inconsistent this season, so I don’t know what to expect from him in the big moment.
Jill Jaracz: back to the void, we have a Pope [00:48:00] program themed, you know, for Italy.
Sarah Hughes: Listen, I’ve been trying to say we, does somebody have a line to Pope Leo? Because I feel like he should, I mean, the Olympics are down the street basically from the Vatican.
I mean, am I right? I don’t know the, I don’t know the geography. But I know we’re in the same rough general area. I’m like, we gotta get him to come and watch this conclave program that Daniel Grassl is doing. Because, I mean, not obviously it’s a conclave program, but it’s a program by an Italian in Italy.
Like I think, you know, it should be a big crowd pleaser. You know, he should really have the crowd with him. And um, you know, Grassle definitely is not. My cup of tea artistically all the time. But I think this program has been great for him because it’s weird and it’s unique and so it makes him stand out and it makes him really memorable.
And so, you know, you like what you’re saying is like we have a pop program, it’s stands out to you, right? Because it’s like [00:49:00] that guy is dressed as a cardinal for three minutes skating around and then he rips open the robe to reveal a white robe indicating that he has now become the pope. And that is happening in the span of a four minute program on the ice.
Like you know, that’s amazing stuff. That’s great tv it’s must see, you know? So I do think if anyone is listening to this, who knows somebody at the Vatican or who just knows somebody in Chicago because Pope Leo is from Chicago. Yes he is. I think we need to get a formal invite out there. And you know what else is, Stanley Tucci is working for NBC during these Olympics and you know, obviously was in conclave.
So I’m like, we gotta, there’s so many crossover opportunities here. We need Stanley, we need the pope, we need them in there together watching Daniel Grassle become the Pope at the Olympics
Jill Jaracz: with, with a Snoop Dogg take.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah. And let’s get Snoop Dogg in there too, just [00:50:00] for good measure. Absolutely.
Absolutely. I’m all for it. That’s what I want see.
Previewing the women’s Olympic figure skating competition at Milano Cortina 2026
Alison Brown: So last but not least, probably the most open discipline is the women’s ’cause. It feels like when I did the math, depending on who Japan sends, I came up with 10 names that could end up on the podium.
Sarah Hughes: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Alison Brown: And I probably missed a bunch.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah,
Alison Brown: there is a lot of women who not only could end up at the podium, but end up with the gold.
Sarah Hughes: Yeah, I think that’s right. I think that, so, the women’s situation is really interesting. You know, Calie Sakamoto from Japan, who was the Olympic bronze medalist in Beijing, uh, sort of shockingly, you know, she was like in that crazy hubbub at the end with the Russian skaters where, you know, she’s just sort of sitting there as Anna Sheba Cova realizes that she wins and calories like, wait, did I just get on the podium?
Because everyone expected the Russian sweep. And after [00:51:00] that she won three straight world titles, and then she got second this past year to Alyssa Lu. from the United States, another comeback. although, you know, I would call that, I would call Alyssa’s Comeback a a little different than like the Sway and Han the Gillam, the shi botani, because she probably still had more to do and is so much younger than they are.
so Alyssa Lu comes back, she’s being super casual and is like, sure, this is fun. And she just wins the world title, you know, almost by accident is how it appears. You know what I mean? Where it’s just she’s just like doing her jumps and then all of a sudden, you know, other people didn’t do all their jumps and she wins the world title, which sets, the entire women’s discipline on this interesting trajectory for this Olympic season.
and so I think that Cal Sakamoto is the best skater in the world, period. She doesn’t have the highest tech ceiling because she’s not doing high value jumps like the triple axle, like a quad. but she [00:52:00] is one of the best jumpers with the jumps that she does.
So, however, take that however you want, but she’s, uh, an incredible skater, like a really, really great emotional performer. she’s announced that she’s gonna retire after this season, which I think adds kind of an extra layer when you’re watching her skate this season that, you know, helps her, you know, that I think that helps that, judges are sort of like appreciating what they have while they still have it because she’s so, so good.
just as like the most incredible foundational skating skills. And, I think that if Cowie does two clean programs, it’s gonna be hard. To put someone ahead of her and not have a lot of people really frustrated with that. she got third, at the Grand Prix final, but she made a big mistake in her short program and she would’ve won without it.
and that’s with two women ahead of her, you know, one of Whom’s doing a triple axle, and one of them is Alyssa Li again. Alyssa, [00:53:00] I think, looking at this Grand Prix final, you have four Japanese women. You have Alyssa L and you have Amber Glenn from the us. Alyssa is really, prob probably the, like if you had told me Alyssa got sixth at the Grand Prix final in this field, I would’ve said, yeah, okay.
Because her foundational skating skills are not as strong and she’s not doing a triple axle or, or like a high ticket element like that. Right. But Alyssa. Come hell or high water is gonna skate her program cleanly. She’s gonna just check off her jumps and do them, and she’s gonna have a, a good time doing it, which sucks the audience in, you know, it makes them have a good time.
’cause she just looks like she’s having a good time. And all of the other women this weekend made mistakes in their programs. So, you know, so Alyssa ends up on top. again, I don’t know if that’s predictive of anything because like I was saying in the high stance, it’s like when you see big mistakes, it’s harder to know than, okay, well how would they have [00:54:00] evaluated it if it was all clean?
I don’t know for sure. I don’t think Alyssa would’ve won if everybody was clean here. you know, Amber Glenn made a really big mistake. I, I think Amber Glenn has as high a ceiling as anyone in the world. She also has, you know, had a lot of inconsistency that plagues her at big events sometimes. but I think she has just as high as healing as, as Calie does because she has an incredible triple axle.
Amber’s a great performer. She has one of the best programs of the season in her Madonna, and the short program is just a huge crowd pleaser and it’s like an awesome program that Caitlyn Weaver choreographed for her. if she can go clean, I think she’s on the Olympic podium. and I think she’d be ahead of Alyssa.
and you know, I think she’d be ahead of a couple of the Japanese women as well. You referenced the Japanese women, so I’ll talk about that.
Alison Brown: Yes. That getting onto the Japanese team is harder than winning an Olympic medal. I would pause it.
Sarah Hughes: I [00:55:00] agree. I agree with you. yeah, so like I said, just in this field of six.
The Japanese women had four of these, you know, six women who were the top performers in the fall. they had at least three more, four more women, who were successful on the Grand Prix. Skated quite well on the Grand Prix, who at times in the last few years have been on world podiums, have been on Grand Prix podiums, who are fan favorites, who did not make this Grand Prix final.
And Japan is pretty methodical about the way they select their team and they wait. The Grand Prix results pretty heavily in addition to their nationals results, which we’ll get really soon in two weeks. but I think that this. Grand Prix final. These four are probably the only remaining names in the mix for their three spots, just because of the math.
I just think that that’s, historically, that’s how we’ve seen Japan evaluates skaters. Now had Cal [00:56:00] Sakamoto, for instance, had a fluky season and not made the Grand Prix final. I might not say that applies to her, but the other women, for the most part are a little less experienced, a little less established than a three time world champion.
And so, you know, they’re may be, you know, not gonna get the benefit of the doubt in the way that Calie might have. So she’s in here, I think she’s going to the Olympics. Like I can’t imagine a situation where you don’t send someone who’s won three of the four world titles in the quad. Right. and then, going into this weekend, Mona Chiba, I was thinking who was.
On the world podium in Boston, um, with Cowry and with Alyssa. and I, I was thinking going into this Grand Prix final, Mon Chibas safe, she’s safe. And then she fell twice this weekend and I’m like, oh no. Like, is she not? She still beat one other, you know, so she was the third of the four here. So I think we are probably looking at a Japanese team that is Ami Nakai, who’s brand new senior skater this year, who’s [00:57:00] awesome.
She has a triple axle and just is, has this sort of effervescent performing energy on the ice. She’s so fun to watch. You can like, feel the youth like seeping off of her as she’s skating. It’s infuriating. I’m like, why am I not, I’ve never been that young in my life. and, uh, so, you know, and she’s been skating really well.
She got second at the Grand Prix final. She’s beaten Calie twice this season, actually. and so I, I think it’s gonna be hard, again, anyone can have a complete yard sale disaster at nationals because it’s very, it’s a, high pressure event. But if everyone is roughly solid, even with some small mistakes, I would guess that am Naka Kaari.
Sakamoto. Monet Chiba are the Japanese Olympic team. I think those are, and, and I think that’s what it should be. I think those are their three skaters who have been the most consistent and the strongest, and who will be the most competitive for Olympic medals in February. We’ll see what they do.
Alison Brown: And on that team, you are leaving off world medalists?
Sarah Hughes: [00:58:00] Yes.
Alison Brown: From the, from the previous quad. I mean, these Japanese women they’re gorgeous. Yeah. I love the Japanese style.
Sarah Hughes: Yes.
Alison Brown: And it’s so much fun. The guy is just.
Sarah Hughes: She’s awesome. Yeah.
Alison Brown: So beautiful to watch. Yeah. And the dress is gorgeous and the choreography is, it’s like, my goodness, where did you just like open up one of those snow globes and take her out and just pop
Sarah Hughes: her down?
I know. Well, and especially like, she’s, she’s skating to, you know, what a Wonderful world in her free skate. And it really does feel like you’re watching someone in a snow globe with that music playing. ’cause she’s in, you know, this sort of like light blue, like wintry sort of shade, um, with all the glitter and you’re like, wow, this is okay.
It’s like, it’s, it’s a vision, you know? It really is. And what’s amazing about Amaka is, like I said, I mean. First year senior, like she has so much she can improve on still, you know, this is how she’s skating right now as such a young teen, like a teenage skater. [00:59:00] you know, Kaari Sakamoto is at the end of her career.
And I remember, you know, when I first saw her skate in person was in practice at the Pyeongchang Olympics. Um, and she was sort of a surprise on that team. she, you know, hadn’t really done a lot, internationally and she skated really well at the Japanese nationals that year. And she got the second Japanese spot.
And I remember watching her just skate around being like, whoa, she’s talented. And to look at her now, she’s so much more talented now. And so that’s how I feel about Ami Nakai is like, I’m like, I hope. That we are watching Ami for, you know, the next eight years, the way that we watched Cowie, just become better and better and better at the craft because she really has a ceiling that, that is a lot.
She reminds me so much of Cowie in that way.
Alison Brown: We’re gonna get two Russian women.
Sarah Hughes: We’re gonna get a Bella Russian. And a Russian.
Alison Brown: What do we do with [01:00:00] this in terms of where their, where their scores, where we expect their scores to be? Are they following in this kind of recent Russian history where we’re just gonna throw quads at you and kind of skate around, but blow you out of the water with our numbers?
Sarah Hughes: I think it’s possible. well, so I should say Victoria sva, who is gonna, she’s the Bella Russian in question She won’t do that. You know, she doesn’t have quads, she doesn’t have, you know, she will, she will do a normal program and probably finish somewhere in sort of the middle of the pack.
but Aade Petro from Russia, does have a quad tow. Um, she does have two of them in her free skate, yeah. I think it’s a, it’s a question of, you know, how, how do they manage, you know, scoring that, you know, it’s like, I, I was just saying. About the men. You know, your artistic scores a lot of times do reflect your experience and what you’ve done to this point internationally.
And she obviously [01:01:00] has basically no track record internationally, so I would expect to see her artistic scores be a bit low. That being said, it’s the same thing with when you talk about IA melanin. It’s like if she does two clean quads, her, I mean. That, that value is going to be really high. So the other women, you know, and, and again, like these other women, they do, you know, a lot of them are trying to do triple axles and they have those, but you think, let’s think about someone like Calie who’s not doing a triple axle and is gonna do what we consider a normal program.
you take that and you put that against something that has a couple of quads in it, and she’s going to be immediately behind in base value by, you know, 10 to 15 points probably. and so do I think that calorie has the quality in her actual, in her jumps, in her elements, grade of execution and artistry to make up 15 points?
I do. Yes. Um, so I think that’s possible. I think also, there’s such [01:02:00] little like minutia that skating fans think about, but like Aade Petro, because she has no international track record, will skate. I believe second in the short program because SVA will skate first. and. That won’t help with the scores because, judges are, you know, basically you’re always gonna get a lower score if you skate earlier.
That’s just, you know, sort of historically That’s true in part because, you know, the judges don’t have a good gauge on what they’re seeing yet. You know, there’s nothing to compare it to yet. So they are usually a little more conservative, you know, because they’re not sure what they’re gonna, it’s like, you know, on those tiktoks where you’re like, okay, you’re doing a blind rating and they show you like the NFL quarterbacks and you have to pick your hottest NFL quarterbacks one to 10, and they show you one, and you have to choose what number he is.
You’re generally not gonna put the first one you see at number one or number two because you’re like, well, I don’t know who else I’m gonna get. And so that’s how figure skating judging works a lot. So I don’t think that her [01:03:00] skating that early in the short program is going to be helpful. but you know, if she does a, a strong program, she can end up in the final group in the free skate and then she will be amongst the higher scores and then it will come down to, like I say, can the other women make up in quality what she has in quantity
Alison Brown: in any discipline, other programs that people should make a point of tuning into, even though they’re not gonna win a medal.
Sarah Hughes: Oh, I’m so glad you asked me this. Yes. I have two things that I’m gonna say. The first one? Yes.
Let’s do Jaws. Laura Noki Gman from Italy is doing a program to Jaws where she is a shark for at least part of the program. and it is so weird and awesome, like it works. I remember watching it for the first time. I couldn’t believe how well it works. you know, because I really had no faith at all that that was a good program concept.
and she does all these, you know, she does a spin [01:04:00] where she’s sort of cr, she’s creating like a dorsal fin with her elbow, and she, draws her eyeliner on in the, you know, shape of a fish fin. Like, you know, she’s like all in on this. and it’s so, so good. And she’s a, she’s a great skater, you know, so she’s been skating really cleanly all season, so, and she’s gonna be, you know, at home in Italy.
So she’s gonna be a crowd favorite. So definitely watch her free skate the jaws. Then Vladimir Litvinov from Azerbaijan. You have to watch this free skate. You all really should watch both of his programs. This is like my, I mean, the void, like shot him out of a cannon this year with their real, their best stuff because he, um.
He does like a really weird program that has like Pew, pew, pew sounds in the short program. But then in the free skate, he is doing the Joker and he does this really campy rendition of being the Joker. and when he is skating, well, it really works. Like he, [01:05:00] starts the program leaning against the boards in front of the judges and mimes smoking a cigarette, which is, you know, huge, huge props from me, a famous smokers rights advocate.
But you know, he does, there’s a part of the program where he kind of skates in front of the judges and he draws a heart with his fingers at them, um, and blows a kiss. And like, it’s just, it’s campy, it’s weird, it’s so fun. Like, he’s not gonna, he’s not gonna win a medal period. But he, is really fun to watch.
So I, those are two programs that I would identify right off the bat that I don’t think people should miss.
Jill Jaracz: Excellent.
Alison Brown: We can talk for another hour, but Yes. we’ll control ourselves. Sarah, thank you so much. This has been fantastic.
Sarah Hughes: Of course. Thank you for having me. This is really fun.
I’ll come back anytime, so you just let me know anytime you need, you know, some void commentary and I’ll make myself available.
Jill Jaracz: Excellent. Thank you.
Thank you so much Sarah. We will have links to the run through in the show [01:06:00] notes and if you are getting hooked on figure skating, but don’t know much about the sport. over, uh, summer 2025, they did a series called The Lore, where they did deep dives into the history of all four disciplines, and it was pretty amazing.
Thank you listener Meredith, for tuning us into that. But, it’s hours of podcasts, but definitely worth spending the time if you wanna know the history of the sport
Alison Brown: and even if you think you know the history of the sport. You will learn so much in this lore and have so much fun doing it, and you will understand why we are fighting for smoker’s rights.
That’s a reference to those, to those episodes. And a skater who went a little off the rails, let’s say.
Who will represent Japan in figure skating at the 2026 Olympics?
Jill Jaracz: Yeah. So it’s, it’s absolutely fantastic. Do check out the run through. Um, Some of the National Olympic committees have already started naming their teams. Japan was one of the first who made the list.
Alison Brown: [01:07:00] So the women are going to be Carrie Sakamoto, Mona Chiba, and Amme Naka. Very excited about that. Yes. Pairs we’re gonna see the former world champions, Rico Uri and Riu Chi Khara, and then they will be joined by Yuna.
NACA and Sum Matata, Morag, Gucci. The dance team is only going to be for the team event. They will not be competing in, the dance event, but it is Yana, Yida and Messiah, Marita. And then for the men, we’re gonna have Yuma, CAAMA, Kamira, and Sato. So this is gonna be a very formidable team. I think it’s gonna be the US and Japan competing for gold in the team event.
Jill Jaracz: Yeah, but we have talked about this before, how excited we’ve been for the reemergence of Japan and Japanese figure skating.
Alison Brown: Yes. I love the style. I love both the men and the women. And now to see the pairs and now seeing a dance [01:08:00] team that’s starting to get some traction.
is exciting as well to just see them across all four disciplines.
Jill Jaracz: So they will help make for a super exciting figure skating competition because as we talked about with Sarah, it, there are a lot of people that are in the hunt for the podium and this will be definitely competitions to tune into and some of the, The disciplines will be, we don’t know who can really take it home. You have ideas, but not sure
Alison Brown: the women is going to be the discipline where there’s no way I can be. Well, there’s very little way. There’s very few ways I can be unhappy with who wins, and there’s very few ways I can be happy because it’s like I want five different girls to, to be on that podium.
So not everybody can be there unless we have ties and no tiebreakers and, but isn’t it nice to have a women’s event [01:09:00] where we can be happy about it again?
Support the show’s production of the 2026 Milano Cortina Games
Jill Jaracz: Yes. So it’ll be fun to watch and we cannot wait to bring you the competition from Milano Cortina. And really the only way we can do that is with your support.
Alison Brown: Yes. So we have our fundraiser going on. You can find that@flamealivepod.com. There’s a popup that’ll come in in our fancy Milan blue. We’re being very Italian with , our Italian blue, and. They’re great, thank you. Gifts, and most importantly, it gets the show to Milan so that you can hear all the stories.
if you’re not going, we will go for you and get all the stories and information that, uh, we can only get when we’re there.
Jill Jaracz: Exactly. We’ll give you the behind the scenes of what goes on. How we get lost in Italy. ’cause I’m sure that’s gonna happen, but you know, just give you the flare and feel for what the Olympics is like in a way that you can’t get it on [01:10:00] your, from your regular Olympics providers.
Alison Brown: This is not polished, this is not, this is not logistically planned out with a whole team. This is Jill and I. Braven, the winds braven the snow in the mountain. But you know what, that’s the point of the show. That’s what makes it fun for us and I think what’s make makes it fun for all of you out there.
Jill Jaracz: Right? So please help us get the show there and yeah, with your support we can get there and, , help bring you. The coverage that you want to hear. So I hope you all are going to have a happy New Year. Happy 2026. Happy Olympic and Paralympic year. We’re so excited to bring you coverage from the games and make this the best Olympic year and make this the best Olympic and Paralympic year ever.
on that,
Alison Brown: and if you haven’t had enough figure skating. We got more figure skating
Jill Jaracz: coming. , That’s right. Next week we will talk with us. [01:11:00] Figure skaters. Amber Glenn, Jason Brown, and Spencer Howe. Next week is US figure skating nationals. So we will have on skaters, to get you in the mood for that.
Thank you so much for listening,
Alison Brown: and until next time, keep the flame alive.