Alison went to the 2025 World Figure Skating Championships in Boston and has all of the behind-the-scenes details! Find out what you can’t see on TV and how different the skater’s performances were in person!
Speaking of performances, the US had a very good tournament, securing quotas in all disciplines. Here’s how the podiums break down:
Men
- Ilia Malinin – USA
- Mikhail Shaidorov – KAZ
- Yuma Kagiyama – JPN
Check out the winning program (which, amazing as it is, we have thoughts about):
Women
- Alysa Liu – USA
- Kaori Sakamoto – JPN
- Mone Chiba – JPN
Alysia Liu–what the hell?!?!
Pairs
- Riku Miura / Ryuichi Kihara – JPN
- Minerva Fabienne Hase / Nikita Volodin – GER
- Sara Conti / Niccolo Macii – ITA
It’s so exciting to see JPN topping the podium!
Ice Dance
- Madison Chock / Evan Bates – USA
- Piper Gilles / Paul Poirer – CAN
- Lilah Fear / Lewis Gibson – GBR
a. Who can possibly top them?
b. That dress!
In this episode, get the scoop on all of the figure skating celebs Alison met in the elevator, as well as details of what portions NBC commentators Tara Lipinski and Johnny Weir actually cover. Plus, we have the up-and-coming skaters you’ll likely see at the next Winter Olympics in Milan-Cortina!
Be sure to check out our figure skating-themed Patreon episode this month, and for more World Champs talk, sign up for our free Substack.
Photo: ©International Skating Union (ISU)
TRANSCRIPT
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384-2025 World Figure Skating Championships Recap
Theme Music
Hello and welcome to another episode of Keep the Flame Alive, the podcast for fans of the Olympics and Paralympics. If you love the Games, we are the show for you. I am your host, Jill Jarris, joined as always by my lovely co-host, Alison Brown.
Alison, hello. I’m not even gonna ask how you are. I’m so jealous of the whole weekend that you just had.
Alison Brown: It’s been amazing to see. It was amazing to live.
I got to spend the weekend at the World Figure Skating Championships in Boston, one of our favorite places. We both lived [00:01:00] there, at the TD Garden for three straight days.
I missed the first day and then the exhibition day, but there, there was a lot going on in those three days.
Jill Jaracz: Excellent. We will get right into it. This, that’s what this episode is going to focus on. We’re saving news for our regular episode this week. uh, if you’d like figure skating, you will love our Patreon Paton episode this month, which just dropped.
it is the third installment of our series. Can you become Olympic in your Endeavors? And we are examining different athletes’ memoirs. This month we’re looking at figure skatings, Peggy Flemings, the Long program, and Dorothy Hamill’s a Skating Life, and can we learn something about them or, you know, maybe things to avoid.
Maybe, uh, you can find out how to join at patreon.com/flame Alive pod. There’s gonna be links in the show notes for that. So do check it out. Okay. Figure skating worlds just, where do you even start?
What you can’t see on TV
Alison Brown: So mostly we’re gonna talk about what, [00:02:00] uh, the things you can’t see on television because you can watch the programs.
I’ve got a few comments in that, but I wanna talk about all the stuff that’s happening that you cannot see when you are not there or if you’re not, if you’re there but you’re not
Jill Jaracz: pressed. Okay. But I do have a question. Yes. Did you notice a difference watching it in person versus watching it on tv? I’m gonna get to that.
Okay. I have notes. I have notes on everything.
Alison Brown: So first I’m gonna start with thank you so much, ISU for making this logistically pleasant. I. The entrance was where they said it was gonna be. Our accreditation was where they said it was going to be. It was amazing.
So get to accreditation. The lovely, here’s one thing. If you’ve ever lived in Boston, you’ll know something about Bostonians. They are not necessarily the nicest people in the world, but they are so kind, so they will help you. So nice security guard. I did [00:03:00] not get his name. He saw me coming. He said, are you looking for accreditation?
I said, I am. He pointed me to the right door. I came out, he said, where are you going now? I said, I’m going to my hotel. He gave me directions when I came back, he said, what do you need now? I said, where’s my entrance? He walked me. What? He walked me to my entrance. Wow in the loading dock.
Jill Jaracz: Oh,
Alison Brown: that’s, that’s a Bostonian for you.
Yeah, exactly. So all the accredited people, athletes, coaches, ISU officials, all the journalists went through one entrance, which we’re not used to, we’re used to getting split up. and then we rode two elevators, the service elevators. So you would have, you know, Scott Hamilton and Joe from food service and his giant cart, an EMT, a couple of cops, and the ISU President all in the elevator at the same [00:04:00] time.
Wow. We’re gonna get to who Allison met in the elevator.
Jill Jaracz: So did your elevator, did you go have to go down and up for different things or just where were you in relation to the elevator in the main entrance?
Alison Brown: Okay. So our entrance was first floor, third floor was the media workroom. But it was also the, where the, uh, metal assistants got dressed.
It was where physio was. It was where the press conference and the mix zone was. So basically everything was happening on the third floor. And then our viewing was up on the fifth floor. Broadcasters were down on the first floor.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, interesting.
Alison Brown: So I almost never saw the broadcasters.
Jill Jaracz: Okay. Do you know how that related to what typically happens at TD Garden for a hockey or a basketball game?
You know, I don’t know.
Alison Brown: , because I. The judges, I think were where the benches would be for hockey. Okay. that’s an excellent [00:05:00] question. I, I haven’t been to the new TD Garden ’cause it was redone since I’ve moved from there. Mm-hmm. Um, for a hockey game, so I couldn’t be entirely sure.
Jill Jaracz: Okay. I, you know, and I only ask that because after being in Paris where we had the Sta de France where we obviously were in media seating and in, uh, Roland Garros, we were obviously using the media, facilities that they have on site.
But, you know, a lot of the stuff we get is, made up because they’ve built a stadium or, you know, they’re, they’re putting you in with, the regular bleachers just sectioning off for you. But when you’re in one of these. Already existing sports stadiums, there’s sometimes stuff
Alison Brown: for you there. Yeah, the media room was made up.
Okay. We had, it was all curtains and folding tables.
Jill Jaracz: Okay.
Alison Brown: And the, the media seating was off the sports deck, which is kind of a re which is a restaurant. Oh. That they had shut down. Um, and had our dinner there [00:06:00] actually, if I didn’t get dinner. But some people got dinner and then the seating for that. So it was, we were on the same loj level with all the boxes.
Jill Jaracz: Okay.
Alison Brown: So I don’t think this is the normal media seating because it was much more probably than they normally have for, uh, you know, an ordinary Celtics or a Bruins game. I would think that would just be a handful of reporters where there was a, there was so many Japanese reporters at this event, and so many Japanese photographers.
So many, okay. Let’s get to who Alison met in the elevator. So first ride, Tara Lapinski and Johnny Weir.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, wow. Wow. That
Alison Brown: starts off with a bang right off the bat. got out of the elevator on a different day. Saw my friend Andrea Joyce, lovely. Who remembered me, Scott Hamilton, who I, I posted a picture of.
I was so excited ’cause I took a picture and I was like, can I be unprofessional and take a picture? I was like, sure. He’s as lovely as you would. Expect and hope, [00:07:00] Madison Hubble and Zach Donahue. Woo. She’s very tall. Is she? She is that. Well, I know, I think everybody’s tall, but for everybody else, she and and Zach are like that same height, which really surprised me.
Oh, lots of competitors were in the same elev. You know, we were with all the skaters. I had a lovely chat with, um, Olivia Smart Oh, the ice dancer from Spain. She was lovely. Her partner, Tim Diac rode his, wheelie suitcase out of the elevator. But here’s the one that’s gonna blow your mind. A teza. What, what, what, what is she doing there?
Is she allowed? She was not sanctioned, and she is the coach of several of the Georgian skaters and her daughter Diana Davis, is the ice dancer from Georgia.
Jill Jaracz: Whoa.
Alison Brown: She is a [00:08:00] terrifying woman.
Jill Jaracz: Was she wearing a big fur
Alison Brown: coat? She, no. She was wearing a navy blue full, wool coat. Looks very nondescript to see her.
Had almost no makeup on. Very, if I didn’t know her, I wouldn’t notice her. But when she looks at you, I thought I was going to turn to stone. Whoa. But it gets better. So one of the things they gave us as part of our lunch were these nice little cupcakes and cookies, and I was like, oh, let me take a couple cookies and I’ll have them later.
So I’m holding a plate of two big cookies. She looks at me, she looks at the cookies, she looks at me and just shakes her head. What like. You do not eat to eat those cookies. Wow. Wow. But my floor came first, so I got to knock her. Well, I didn’t knock her over, but I did push past her with my cookies and I’m like, yeah, that’s why I’m fat Terry taking you out.[00:09:00]
Wow. Yeah. So her skater can’t be there, you know, the Russian skaters can’t be there because, you know, so, so many reasons. But you know, Camilla, Eva was 15 years old and somehow doped herself, but it
Jill Jaracz: Terry’s there. Wow. I’m, I’m sorry. I’m still like all of the politics around that. Just shocking. Anyway,
Alison Brown: you were talking about what looks different.
on the broadcast. So Tara and Johnny, I could see them. They had a very special broadcast spot. They were in the corner. I don’t know where the other broadcasters are. NBC gets prime location, prime space. Everybody else is just kind of someplace.
Jill Jaracz: Hmm. I wonder how many other broadcasters there were.
Alison Brown: Well, I know CBC was there. Okay. I know, there was a, somebody from Japan. Somebody from Japan, and somebody from Europe at least. Okay. I don’t know where they were. Tara and Johnny do not come [00:10:00] out for the first group in the short programs. They don’t come out for the second group. Oh. They only announce the third group for certain people.
Jill Jaracz: Right. Okay. ’cause I’ve had, I didn’t get a chance to watch them live on Peacock or on NBC and I have not. Admittedly going back to Peacock ’cause I’ve been a little busy with Ma Jarris. I have watched select performances on YouTube. Not all of them are from NBC because they don’t exist.
Alison Brown: Right.
They do not cover all of them. when they’re not on camera. Johnny wears a giant fake fur in varying colors. He had a white one, a green one, and a brown one that I saw.
Wow. At one point, Tara had on a fleece lined acid wash denim jacket Wow. Over her gown and a blanket. She seems to be more of a blanket person, but he puts on this giant furry coat, [00:11:00]
Jill Jaracz: but it does get cold. It’s really chill all day. And they ringside the all day. Yes,
Alison Brown: they are ringside and I for, for certainly for Tara.
Her on camera dresses tended to be quite. Bare. Mm-hmm. So yeah, you sit there and it’s not comfy. So if you’re not on camera, stay warm people. I would, I would absolutely agree with that. The other thing that came off very odd was colors of the costumes were very different. We had monitors and there was a jumbotron, so I would be film b Fran and I got into a little, uh, tiff over text During the Italian Ice dancers?
No, the Italian pair skaters, because she kept telling me that their costumes were blue. And I said, I’m sitting here looking at them. They’re green. and blues really looked different. They would always, look darker.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting sparkles
Alison Brown: were less sparkly on camera.
Jill Jaracz: [00:12:00] Interesting. Maybe that’s why they overdo it with the, the sparkle so that it looks okay on camera.
Alison Brown: You know what, the dress always looked better in person, but that’s who’s judging you. I mean, that’s whom you care about. The other thing that I noticed, because I’ve gone back and today I was watching a lot of the televised coverage, it plays so differently on TV than it does in the stadium or in the arena.
They’ll talk a lot about the electric atmosphere and it just because a crowd is cheering does not mean it is electric.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, so was there a cheering crowd and not an electric atmosphere in the men’s Really?
Alison Brown: it got more, but it was, they were very loud. They love a good back flip. Boston loves if you say thank you to them.
Also loves if you, they, because all the skaters had messages that flashed onto the screen of the jumbotron before they skated. So if they said anything about, I love you [00:13:00] Boston, or Thank you for coming to see me, or I’m just trying to do a good job, the crowd would cheer for the skater. Oh. Then there was a, the Canadian Pears team one who said, go, Habs.
Go. And the other said, go Leafs. Go. And if you know anything about hockey, you have just watched into the Bruins arena and come for their necks. I was afraid for those Canadians lives.
Jill Jaracz: Whoa. They got,
Alison Brown: they did not quite get booed, but they did get the Boston. Ooh.
The other thing that really brought crowds together was if, a skater was struggling. The minute they did anything, a spin, a jump and landed it. The crowd would just be absolutely with them, which was really fun. smart and Diac did a dune, free dance ants. You have to go back and watch it and just take my word for that. The [00:14:00] crowd was me mesmerized. It does not play on camera, but in person. This thing was brilliant. The reverse is true of the Piper Gillis. Paul Poirier program. Kind of fell flat in the arena, works on camera.
Interesting. Very odd. Thankfully figure skating media box. We can cheer.
Jill Jaracz: Oh really? Remember
Alison Brown: we ran into that in Paris that there was this question of, you know, does the media clap? Does the media not clap? No. Most figure skating media, you, you cheer a good thing, which was, I was so relieved. And there is nothing better than sitting next to Jackie Wong, rocker skating when someone he really wants to do well is doing well.
I thought he was gonna have a stroke when Alyssa Lewis was skating.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, [00:15:00] really? Awe.
Alison Brown: Every, I mean, we were all so excited for her because she just did, I mean, if you saw it, you know, it was. Beyond belief, but like every jump, the poor kid could not sit down. I’m like, Jackie, you’re gonna hurt yourself.
He couldn’t sit down. He couldn’t. He was so excited and he’s like, one more jump and she’s gonna have it. that was fun to actually have a media box where I could be a fan. It was great.
Remember in Paris we heard a lot of freed from desire.
Jill Jaracz: Mm-hmm.
Alison Brown: I’m shipping up to Boston. Oh yeah. Course I dropped Dick Murphy’s
Jill Jaracz: of course,
Alison Brown: every single break. So every single group of skaters that got introduced in every single session, shipping up to Boston.
I was in, what, five sessions?
Jill Jaracz: Okay.
Alison Brown: With, with
Jill Jaracz: about 12 breaks each at least.
Alison Brown: So maybe in another month I’ll like it [00:16:00] again. Okay.
Jill Jaracz: Alright. Fair. Yeah. But yeah,
Alison Brown: Boston crowds everything that you would want. They’re good. It’s a good place to have a skating tournament. It really is. It really is. And people seemed to, the skaters liked it, coaches were talking about it.
kind of touched base with some, some various volunteers here and there, and everybody really was happy to be in Boston. I think that’s why they keep going back. I mean, US nationals have been there a bunch of times. Um, worlds was there in 2016. You can’t complain, but I am gonna complain because there was the Brian Ano lounge where you could have the legends encounter, you know, who wasn’t allowed to have a legend encounter.
You, well, anybody with a press pass, no press allowed. So I had, I did have a legend encounter when I met Scott Ton in the, in the elevator. And then, Gracie Gold, Nathan Chen and Katina Fitt came down to the mix zone Oh [00:17:00] nice. And did a little event, but he was the best moment. So I’m standing chatting with one of the ISU volunteers and.
We were talking local stuff and just how the program has been, and Caterina comes over and she says to her, oh, is this where I’m supposed to be for the legends encounter and volunteer very professionally? She says, oh, yes, you’re, you just need to wait right here. I’m, we’ll be starting in a few minutes.
She’s like, oh, thank you, volunteer. And I look over each other and start giggling like 14-year-old girls. Countering of it is so beautiful in person and just so lovely, unexpectedly lovely and very ordinary. Like she wasn’t, she didn’t have people with her, like she was just coming down and asked the volunteer where she was supposed to be.
I loved that Gracie Gold Poor thing. Didn’t, she had agreed to do this, didn’t know what she was getting into. I was telling her person I, what, what am I, I’m here. What am I [00:18:00] doing? And just handled it like a trooper was absolutely great. She has a, a new bow who made several appearances on karaoke cam in between sessions.
Let’s just say he looked like he had had a few, but hadn’t. Oh, he really got into dancing on karaoke cam. I couldn’t film in the arena ’cause we weren’t allowed to, to film. Right. But man, karaoke cam was something you didn’t see, but I wished you could have
Jill Jaracz: big hit. I’m guessing
Alison Brown: Ashley Wagner and Ben Gusto were kind of the in-house hosts. So they were on jumbotron doing, trivia games and there was a wrong trivia answer. I almost lost my mind. Yes. How many other people
Jill Jaracz: lost their mind?
Alison Brown: I didn’t hear any, ’cause you have to be an old person to know that this was wrong.
the first night it was high skating history questions and they had the absolute audacity to [00:19:00] say that tour and Dean won the first Olympic gold medal in ice dance.
Jill Jaracz: No, no.
Alison Brown: It was in 76. I start losing my mind and then realize, wait, I am completely overreacting. ‘ cause I’m not even playing the trivia game.
It’s, it’s for everybody else. But I’m like, what do you mean they corrected it? The that’s following evening. And I’m like, yeah, that’s right. That’s right. Seven, six not what is wrong with you people? We always talk about the, metal assistance and their outfits. Mm-hmm. This one will, this one will get you. So first of all, the back of the jackets, because I’m not even sure any of the metal ceremonies were on Peacock. I didn’t see them. it had the skyline of Boston on it. Oh, cool. Really nice. But here’s what’ll get you on the inside of the jacket.
It had a heart patch that they put on
Jill Jaracz: Aw. For the plane crash victims
Alison Brown: dedicated specifically to Spencer Lane, [00:20:00] Aw. Was one of the young skaters who was killed on flight 53 42, uh, the crash in DC because he was, uh, a member of the skating club in Boston, who’s one of the official hosts mm-hmm. Of, of events at TD Garden.
And I have some video of that, so I’ll be putting that up of on Instagram, with the woman who was in charge of the, Costume room for them. They let me sneak in and take some pictures and take some video and show a closeup of those, of those outfits. really, really lovely. And they did a tribute of Remembrance, which I was not there for.
That was on Wednesday. I saw it on tv. Beautiful. it wasn’t heavy. They didn’t do a lot of that small touches here and there. Maxim name off performed. Uh, both his parents were killed in the crash. So there were moments, kind of woven into, the program. When you thought of it, it was depressing and upsetting.
Jill Jaracz: Mm-hmm.
Alison Brown: [00:21:00] It was there, it was acknowledged, but it wasn’t dwelled upon. Okay. So I thought they did a really good job of, balancing that. Um, I know Amber, Glen had a shirt. I think with, with some dedications, Alyssa, uh, f Mova and Misha Mitchoff, the American pair had the pictures of the people from the Boston Escalating Club because that’s where they’re based.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, okay. When they
Alison Brown: would, would sat in the kiss and cry. So acknowledged, but not dwelled upon really good job by people handling that, okay. Events, yes.
The Pairs competition
Alison Brown: Let’s get to events. So first time I got there, got there for pairs free skate. there were no Russian couples, but there were a heck of a lot of Russian skaters do tell, of the 40 skaters that were in the Paris, final 10 are Russian born.
Oh, wow. And both pairs and dance. There’s a lot of. Country swapping isn’t really the right term. And partner [00:22:00] swapping sounds completely different, but that is what it is there. There’s a lot of teams that cross countries,
Jill Jaracz: okay.
Alison Brown: In dance and pairs. I’m gonna get, I, I wanna do some investigating on that ’cause that was rough.
Okay? But what was also interesting was at least four of the women’s single skaters in the finals, also Russian born, representing other countries.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting.
Alison Brown: Don’t know when they changed countries, if it was before something to look into, something to, look into as well. Something you cannot see on television is how cookie cutter the patterns are right now in pair skating.
Oh, nearly all the star lifts are done on the vertical, directly across from the the judges.
Jill Jaracz: Okay? Same
Alison Brown: spot, uh, side by side pair drums. North side of the rink to the left of the judges. Interesting. Paris spins south side of the rink to the right of the judges over and over [00:23:00] and over again.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting.
Alison Brown: Which gets kind of boring after a while. Exactly. And apparently it has to do with the entrances and exits in the code of points and how you get into things and out of things. And if you jump clockwise or counterclockwise, you end up putting these elements in the same place. Interesting.
Jill Jaracz: That makes me wanna talk to a choreographer then to understand like how do you make your routine challenging, fit the code of points and be different so it’s not the same, you know?
Oh, this is the 10th routine we’ve seen that looks exactly the same with different music.
Alison Brown: Definitely. And you also can’t see how fast or slow. On the television that they are skating. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Because the Japanese, URI and Kaari were so much faster than everybody else. Oh really? Okay. Their speed was just so significantly different that I noticed it.
[00:24:00] Okay.
Jill Jaracz: They won. So I guess that’s a good thing.
Alison Brown: Yeah. Because they, the, the Japanese did not win the free program. Oh, they, were second in the free program, but we’re far enough ahead in the short.
What was really funny, Bruno Mart, who is married to our chuk Ani, Megan de Hamill is their coach. And he could do the math in his head faster than the computer came up.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, wow. So he was saying,
Alison Brown: it’s enough, it’s enough. It’s enough. because they were on the jumbotron. but nobody else knew except for Bruno.
So Bruno can do math and coach, world champion figure skaters. Wow. Yes. Other ways to get the crowd in Boston to love you. Skate to Rockos. Really? Wait, it gets better. It was a German team, but no, a
Jill Jaracz: Falco is Austrian.
Alison Brown: Oh. But still it’s in German.
Jill Jaracz: Okay.
Alison Brown: I thought that was kind of fun.
The Ice Dance competition
Alison Brown: So next session then was the rhythm Dance was the [00:25:00] following day, which is basically the ice dance short.
This was not aired on Peacock Really? That I saw. it could be on the demand peacock. But you didn’t get to see everybody doing fifties, sixties, and seventies social dances. Okay. That’s what was a
Jill Jaracz: lot. That’s a wide range. Yes. And it basically
Alison Brown: panned out into three categories.
Disco. Easy. Elvis Presley.
Jill Jaracz: Okay.
Alison Brown: And Beatles slash mod sixties.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting.
Alison Brown: There were some interesting interpretations of the social dances of the fifties, sixties, and seventies, and some people seemed to not understand that there are three different things. Like they would mish them up in very odd ways.
Like they’d have a 50 song and then a 70 song, and like, Chuck and Bates did that on purpose. Like they purposely called it like a journey through the decades. And it was very, consciously structured. But there were people I [00:26:00] think, who did not understand what decade they were in.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting.
Alison Brown: I am gonna do a deep dive on the Rhythm Desk costumes that will be coming on the newsletter on Substack.
If you don’t get our newsletter, you can sign up for that at our website, which is flame alive pod.com because as listener Meredith said, choices were made.
Jill Jaracz: I will be looking forward to this. Now, are these choices, as in I, I don’t think a choice would ever reach the Aboriginal appropriation. No, no, no. Nobody was offensive. Okay. Okay. Well, you can’t, how, how offensive can you get with 50, 60 seventies? Oh, oh, okay.
Alison Brown: I got a little concerned when somebody chose Jungle Boogie as their music.
Thankfully, it, it went in the correct [00:27:00] direction.
And once again, some people have a, a little bit of trouble understanding that the seventies are not the eighties. Ooh, yeah. But I do have a best dressed. Okay. And this was, Phoebe Becker and her part, it’s really her ’cause her partner James Hernandez, was just along for the ride when it came to costumes from Grape Britain.
And in her short program they did a Beatles, routine. She had a beaded flower mod style dress. Oh,
Jill Jaracz: cool.
Alison Brown: Stunning. She fully committed, she had kind of that bump it beehive
Jill Jaracz: top. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.
Alison Brown: Makeup, lots of eyeliner and these giant white plastic sort of hoop earrings. Oh, cool. And then in the long program they did a James Bond routine.
Okay. And she had this absolutely stunning red dress. I will get photos to put in the show notes for this ’cause they were gorgeous. The best part about it was I was [00:28:00] able to tell Phoebe Becker that she was my best dressed in the elevator. And then she said to me, well, well how is this decided? I said, I decided, I decided you committed in both routines to your fashion.
And I loved it, but here was the best part. ’cause I asked her, then I said, did the, did the beehive throw off your twizzle? And she said, no. It was, the earrings would slap her in the face.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, that’s hilarious.
Alison Brown: And there were a lot of earrings because you know, you think sixties, you think those big gaudy earrings and I’m thinking a lot of girls took some slaps to the face for fashion.
Sure. Ice dance has the biggest difference between what you see on TV and what you have in person. It is fantastic to see in person. It is not boring, it is not cookie cutter. You see the different patterns. They’re skating, you see the different speeds, how close they are together. It [00:29:00] was so much better in person.
Jill Jaracz: That’s why I liked it at Beijing. I think, you know, it, just watching it in person is,
Alison Brown: is so different. Deepness of the edges. I’m like looking at some of my notes I wrote, how far away that the ICE coverage, oh my goodness. You can never tell how much ice coverage they’re getting on television. In person.
You can, you can see it. Other thing you can see very easily in person is how much space there is between bottom and top and ice dance. And I mean that in the sense of you have like the two first groups that come out, kind of the lower rank skaters that, that kind
Jill Jaracz: of bottom and top
Alison Brown: Jill. You know, it was the seventies disco music, but it wasn’t that kind of show.
Jill Jaracz: Just leave that to your imagination listeners.
Alison Brown: I mean, some of the lifts were [00:30:00] interesting. then you get to that last group who you expect to have the medalists and then chalk and Bates come out. A her, her long program dress was stunning and you can’t even see how stunning it is on television. The detail in the beating and the sparkle was 10 times as great.
And they are so far and away better than everybody else. Like are we even the same competition? And you would think the medalists would be relatively cl No, not even a competition once they came out.
Jill Jaracz: Wow. Which, when you said there were a lot of Russian born skaters now competing, it made me wonder where they were in the big picture because they dominate.
Ice dance, they had dominated women’s, so where are they?
Alison Brown: [00:31:00] You know? But in ice dance, they haven’t dominated in quite a while because of that sort of North American revolution and the change in sport. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And it’s clear that that older style, that less athletic style is just gone. Interesting. I mean, everybody is trying to emulate that North American intricacy, speed, strength, complex lifts.
Jill Jaracz: Mm-hmm.
Alison Brown: There was a Carmen, oh, and shockingly good. It was Anthony Po. Uh, panko and, uh, Christina Carrera from the United States. Cho and Bake certainly are, are gonna retire from competitive skating after next year. I think they’ve pretty much announced it and everyone’s expecting it. Americanized dancing is.
Fine. Good, good is fine. ’cause if you can pull out Carmen, the way these two did, unbelievable Panco is the son of somebody we talked about with our Albertville [00:32:00] shows, marina kva and Sergei Panco who immigrated to the United States, in the mid nineties to become coaches. He is, they are not his coach, which I think is good.
He doesn’t skate like either of them.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, interesting.
Alison Brown: And I think it’s because they were that old school Russian style of the eighties and nineties and he’s that North American style. But then you see him make the face during Carmen and he’s his mother. It was.
I’m like, what is happening? How is this possible? But yeah, and again, I don’t, I think Peacock showed their performance ’cause it was Amer the American pair really, really good worth taking a look at. Even though it’s Carmen and it was a new edit. Oh, okay. Diff I don’t know if this was, you know, the epic edit ’cause somebody did use an epic edit of something, but they, they managed to make [00:33:00] it work.
So it was so much fun seeing ice dance in person. Sad that they stick both their, sessions in the afternoon. Kind of had the smallest crowds because of it. And you had an American win. You would think we would get a little more love.
Jill Jaracz: It’s hard because you got four. Four categories and basically three nights, four May.
Yeah. So you have Thursday, Friday, Saturday, somebody gets a shaft.
Alison Brown: I stands.
Okay.
The Women’s competition
Alison Brown: Then we got women’s. Did you watch this?
Jill Jaracz: I’ve seen Alyssa lose program,
Alison Brown: and this is, this is the big one I wanna talk about. The difference of the crowd was between the men’s and the women’s. The women’s was first, the men’s were on the final night. So the women’s is Friday night.
This crowd, it was sold out. It was full, it was loud. But the difference in the feeling of the crowd was so significant. This truly was an electric crowd. This was a crowd that if we [00:34:00] could have carried the skaters on our backs. We would’ve, if these girls had told us to go march through the streets of Boston, everyone would’ve followed them.
There was so deep a connection between the skaters on the ice and the crowd, and it was so different in the men’s. The men’s, the crowd was there to watch the spectacle. Oh, interesting. The connection between the skater and the crowd. It was like, I’ve gone to see the gladiators versus I’ve gone to see my friends and I want theming to do well.
Interesting. The crowd absolutely lost it. Its mind when Amber Glenn came out and I, that definitely did not come across on tv, how emotional the crowd was. For her skate. She had a very rough, short program, was kind of trying to come back in the long program. Had a good skate, not a great skate, but she did [00:35:00] land that triple axle and that triple axle in person is a site to behold.
Jill Jaracz: Wow.
Alison Brown: Uh, so lucky to have, have gotten that Carrie Sakamoto everything I hoped for in a skater and in a human being. She went out, delivered a fantastic performance. She’s had a rough up and down season. She had a shaky short program. It was good enough, but not what she wanted. Her long program, she doubled a few of the second jump, you know, it wasn’t, it wasn’t a perfect program.
It was very, very good. The crowd adored her. Oh yeah. Just. Adored her, and then she comes off and they have a winner’s chair, and you could see this on tv and they have to sit there. So she’s the rather a leader chair. So she’s the leader. This poor girl just kept crying. She cried when Wabi Haguchi skated, who’s her teammate.
She cried when [00:36:00] Moni Cheba skated, who was also her Japanese teammate. She lost it when Alyssa Luke was skating. She kept alternating between crying and laughing, and they asked her about it in the, press conference, and she still kept crying and laughing during her time with the Japanese press. And it was so genuine because she was doing this when the cameras were not on.
She was doing this in the mix zone. When they were waiting to go into the press conference, she and Alyssa and, and Mona Chiba, who ended up with bronze were still like laughing and hugging and holding hands and, and passing tissues to one another. Really just such a, she loves all the skaters she competes with and they all care and respect of her,
Jill Jaracz: unfortunately the only video I could find on YouTube was a audience member of her long program.
’cause I wondered what [00:37:00] happened in her skate that, uh, wasn’t as good as Alyssa Luce and she’s so fast. And she’s so happy, so beautiful to watch Skate In Person, and I’m so glad that she’s had such a good run from Beijing on, and sorry that she’s having a tough season. Hopefully it gets better. I mean, she ended up with silver.
She didn’t, yeah. No, it’s not too bad, but not too shabby. The one thing I did see in the Alyssa Lu video was her coming over to give Alyssa a big hug. While before her, uh, scores came up or something, uh, it was in the kiss and cry, just like the joy she had and how much she seems to care about her com fellow competitors.
It’s just beautiful to see and
Alison Brown: so good for the sport. And what was really funny was every time they, while she was sitting in the leader’s chair, every time they flashed to her, she was [00:38:00] crying again. And then she would start laughing because she’s up on the jumbotron crying again. And she realized, this is ridiculous, but I can’t.
And, and then one of the things she said in the press conference, was, you know, this happened. And then I started crying again. And then this happened, and then I started crying again. And she realized how ridiculous the, the situation was and was laughing at herself. And I think that’s what’s so special about all these, you know, that this group of skaters is, they feel.
Like they’re in control of what they’re doing and we don’t always see that with, especially the women. And something I wanted to point out, the Americans and the Japanese both had the potential to sweep the podium. That’s how good both countries are. That’s so nice. It and really impressive, really fun.
The best thing I heard was somebody posted on threads how bangs and ponytails are gonna [00:39:00] come back because of Alyssa Lou that we’re gonna see a lot of those at the rink. And she came out before she even started performing. I’m like, she’s on, you know when you just get that feeling from somebody And she did her first jump and I turned to the reporter sitting next to me and.
I can honestly tell you I’ve never seen a jump that perfect. The angle, the a and I looked at him and I said, she’s gonna win. She’s got it. Because when you see something not perfect
Jill Jaracz: mm-hmm
Alison Brown: That just doesn’t come outta nowhere and it doesn’t disappear. So the fact that she then went on to have honestly a perfect program, didn’t surprise me.
And poor Jack, poor Jackie. He was pacing, he was the poor guy. I, I was so worried. ’cause he, we felt it. That was a feeling in the stadium of we are all seeing something magical and people throw that around and throw around the electric. You should have seen these [00:40:00] grizzled reporters just. Standing up and applauding after, after her performance, we were just all on this amazing high.
And you get in the elevator and I’m talking to literally two of the security guys, you know, Boston, Sean, and he was like, that was amazing. I don’t usually watch figure skating. But that girl was so good. Like you didn’t have to understand anything to know. You just saw something really, really special. And the first thing she said was, what the hell?
When she came up the ice and she said it, they did a little interview court, court side, ice side. Mm-hmm. to the sta to the arena. She was just like, what is going on? And that just continued through her whole press conference and in the press conference, in the mix zone on the ice, in the kiss and cry.
And even when they were just kind of hanging around waiting, she was always the same. [00:41:00] Very nice. I never saw that turning on and turning off that we’ve seen many a time. Right, right. From many an athlete. it’s amazing to see and I do feel so lucky to have been sitting in that arena for that performance and I can’t imagine what Milan is gonna look like.
Jill Jaracz: It’ll be interesting. And we talked a little bit in the patron episode about her retire, her abrupt retirement, and then just the kind of random decision to come back. And I’m curious to know how she wants to handle the pressure this time, because you know, she’s just going to get inundated with media requests.
You know, this was a surprise. Right, right. So it’s a big, you know, like I kind of see her as a, a, Chloe, Kim and Chloe had to take a step back and just evaluate like, what is it that I want? And a lot of it is, is that’s trial [00:42:00] and error and like, how do you manage it now that you’re coming back on your terms and owning more of what you’re doing?
Alison Brown: You know, she chose this music, she chose those costumes. She loved her programs. You know, we were joking before about what you said in Beijing about the, the musical enjoyment factor. Mm-hmm. Hers was off the charts. and it showed, you could tell, you could tell when they didn’t like it. Oh. There was a nutcracker routine by one of the, the men and I just wrote down.
Is there something lower than zero on the musical enjoyment factor chart? It was so, and a lot of the, the women had these programs that were clearly just put upon, I mean, at one point in my notes, my notes, actually, I’m reading my notes this morning, I was entertaining myself at, at one time, one of the notes I wrote was, somebody chose this music for her and not somebody hates her.
And [00:43:00] then a few lines down, I wrote, oh no, somebody hates her more. I mean, it was just a few of these girls just really got,
Jill Jaracz: yeah, and you’re stuck with that all season. All season and, and it’s the, well, we can always go back to that program if your new program’s not working out. Like, oh, if you don’t like, I would hope that at some point.
Kids ’cause they get, they are kids at that. But I think it’s a lot of the younger skaters just get told this is what you’re gonna do. It would be nice to have them be able to have more ownership in that and say, this is what I want to do versus the well we have to do, sorry, alleg not getting some love.
But do we need to have that anymore to please the judges,
Alison Brown: you know, not a single malagia,
Jill Jaracz: sorry,
Alison Brown: one Swan Lake. A lot of dune. A lot of dune. But they were good. Olivia smart and, and Tim Dayak did a dune program that would, blow [00:44:00] your mind. a lot of movie music. a lot of Claire de Loon.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting.
Alison Brown: But mostly different music than we usually hear. So I think the judges are moving on from that. Here’s your five pieces of music that you can choose from.
Jill Jaracz: Mm-hmm.
Alison Brown: And let’s get something a little more interesting. But you can tell when somebody, when some old timey coach just like pick their music and force them to skate to it.
Jill Jaracz: Congratulations. You’ve graduated to Tchaik. Kowski.
The Men’s competition
Alison Brown: Okay. And then of course, kind of the crown jewel that everybody was waiting for was the men. You know, everyone who wanted to see if Ilya Molina was gonna do the seven, quads. He changes his program on the fly. Oh, wow. Because, you know, they’ll talk about it sometimes on the television, but we, in the press box, we can see their, their submitted elements, their planned elements.
He doesn’t just, oh, he tripled that quad. Like he will shuffle his jumps. [00:45:00] It’s supposed to be the lutz and, oh, no, no, no, no. He does a flip and, oh, this part is supposed to be a single jump and he does a three jump sequence. Okay. Obviously it’s working for him. He won by 30 points, but I’m wondering how long that can work for him and what’s that?
What is that doing?
Jill Jaracz: That’s interesting for, I would love to know the judge’s standpoint on that. Not necessarily like how easy is it for them to adjust to something that they don’t know necessarily, because they do see these routines a lot apparently, or they’re watching practices or things like that.
How much, if they’re looking for a LUTs and they get a flip, is it, although I guess the entry is different so they can go, okay, this is we’re, we’re switching to this now. But then that explains why when I was watching his long program today, his. In between sequences, in between jumps. I know you’re resting, but they also looked very disjointed to me.
[00:46:00] Or maybe he was distracted or not. They, they just, they weren’t as good. And maybe that’s from reading Peggy Fleming’s book, how she very much loves the artistry in skating, but he did not have complete artistry along with the jumps. There was something missing for me.
Alison Brown: There was something missing for me as well.
Jason Brown, obviously is the, the king of artistry. He got the highest component score of anybody in the competition.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, good, good for him. Um,
Alison Brown: unfortunately, in my opinion, Ilya got the second highest interesting. And I, I really questioned that part of it was several of the skaters like, Yu Akami had really rough days.
Oh. So their component scores, if you fall, your component scored is, is gonna suffer because your, your footwork isn’t looking as sharp. And, and he had a really, really rough, uh, free skate. But this vampire program was a lot of flailing and a lot of dramatic faces and a lot of quads. But [00:47:00] here’s the one thing, he gets up in that quad and he’s like hanging off a fishing line.
He just sits up there. I’ve never seen anything like it. He gets up there and just, it’s like he could do six revolutions before he’d hit the ice.
Jill Jaracz: Wow. It’s, I wonder how he does that, like physically, how he does that comparatively.
Alison Brown: his technique looks very, very different than everybody else’s. And I’m not enough of a skater to know.
I mean, that’s a question for Jackie when we have him back on Okay. To say what’s he physically doing differently than everybody else.
Jill Jaracz: Right. Right.
Alison Brown: Because there’s a, it’s not just he can do it better.
Jill Jaracz: Mm-hmm.
Alison Brown: He’s doing something different.
Jill Jaracz: Interesting. And can we talk Jason Brown for just a minute since you brought it up?
Oh yeah. Okay. So this was another one. I’m not sure. NBC covered him. I They did, they did. Okay. I don’t know what I was watching today, but I was watching Jason Brown and I’m like, a, he’s such a beautiful skater, and b it felt, I, I was just like, if this was [00:48:00] 1992, he would be on top. and I didn’t realize his coaches were.
Tracy Will Wilson and Brian Orser and I went, oh, that’s why
Alison Brown: the, the amount of ICE coverage that he gets. Is better than everybody else. He’s faster, he spins faster. But just physically when he gets, when he does in-between footwork, he does the entire rink in a way that no, nobody else does. He’s got Hamilton.
Jill Jaracz: Yes. You know, and that’s, I mean, it is his in-between stuff that sets him apart and like he can hang in there with the jumps. That’s not a strong suit, but man, I gotta give him credit for sticking in this sport with it changing as much as it is and being powerhouse athletic jumps all the time.
Alison Brown: And then when people have bad, bad jumping days, you’ve got the highest component scores.
That’s why the US figure skating keeps sending him to these [00:49:00] international competitions over some of the other skaters because they know, okay, if you’ve got four or five quads planned. You have a day like Caama did where you don’t land any of them? Oh, poor guy. Maybe he landed one, but he certainly did get much.
Technically, Jason Brown just slips himself in there and does very, very nicely.
Jill Jaracz: Wow. Wow. Did you see Caama Short? Did you see Men’s Short? Oh, on the tv You did?
Alison Brown: Okay. I was supposed to see Men’s Short, but I was trapped on the Amtrak for six and a half hours. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I saw it. All the,
Jill Jaracz: he’s so much fun to watch Skate when he is on so much fun.
That’s why it was heartbreaking, so much fun.
Alison Brown: And him in the press conference, he was really distraught and in that very Japanese way, he says, I’m so sorry to have disappointed all of you. I’m so sorry to have come to the World [00:50:00] Championships and delivered such a poor performance. I have to go back to the drawing board and start completely from scratch.
And I’m like, Yuma, just come here. I will give you a hug. It will be okay. And and he’s such a sweet young man with such a sweet, gentle spirit about him. And to see him struggle, even though he ended up on the podium, he said himself, I didn’t deserve it.
Jill Jaracz: Oh.
Alison Brown: Oh, that broke my heart a little bit. But you know who didn’t break?
My heart was the silver medalist from Kazakhstan. Mikel shot her off. Great little kid. I can call him little. He’s 20. I’m old enough to be his. I mean, even though Ilia is 20, he’s not 20, right? He’s that very worldly, 20 MHA shutoff is not worldly. He’s very young. He had a long program, like you would not believe his, I wanna get his name right.
Here it is. Ivan Reini is his choreographer. [00:51:00] And I think I had almost as fun watching him during Macau’s skate as watching Macal. He was losing his mind. Another person that’s great to watch on the sidelines is Stefan Laal former, world champion, who is now Dennis Lias. Coach that is Lia have had a long program for the ages.
And the two of them, Stephan Lobile, goes up the steps of the stands, goes down the steps, runs across, goes I, Ivan Rini was just, he couldn’t stay still. The arms were flailing. It was very Italian. It was fantastic. And just did this amazing program. Comes off, wins a silver medal unexpectedly, comes down to the press conference.
Who’s Mikhail’s coach? Alex or Bonoff? Wow. Gold medalist from 94. Whoa. Okay. Yes, I know. Lovely. So Alex and Ivan are standing on the side like. Mm, maybe 10 feet away from me and Mikhail’s up at the podium and he’s in, he’s speaking Russian. I [00:52:00] assume it’s Russian. I apologize. and through an interpreter. So he’s not trying to struggle with English or anything, but Alex and and Ivan are coaching him through this press conference, and they’re giving him like, hand signals and like giving him thumbs up and like trying to get, ’cause clearly Mikkel is, a little bit reserved.
He’s not used to doing a lot of this. He’s obviously never won a world medal and they’re just trying to encourage him and it was very, paternal. It wasn’t aggressive. It wasn’t like I’m a scary coach. So I’m watching Alexia do this and I’m laughing to myself. He turns Olympic champion. Alex Armand turns, looks at me, sees me laughing at him, coaching Mikel.
And I’m thinking, I’m gonna have another Atari Ook Bara moment, and this is gonna be the end. No. Alex Orman, Olympic champion, smiles and winks at me. Nice. Like, because it [00:53:00] was one of those moments where, you know, he’s our age. Right. So, and, and you know, he’s, he’s, I have a, just the way their interaction, it felt very parental and protective.
Mm-hmm. Like he wanted his charge to do well in this press conference and he understood it, but not in a scary, like, sleazy agent way.
Jill Jaracz: Right. Right.
Alison Brown: Like in a very fatherly way. And he does, he looks like a soccer dad. He’s got gray hair and his half glasses, but you can still see it’s him. Wow. Which is amazing.
He’s still handsome as ever. Did. And did he wear big puffy sleeves? He did not wear big puffy sleeves. I was like, where are your cuffs, Alex and your gloves? But no, we had this moment where obviously I do not know Alex Airman of Olympic champion and his puffy sleeves, but I was like, oh my God, we all want ML to do well.
Aw. It was really sweet. That was like my favorite moment. But the other hard point of, of the press conference, and I, this is kind of the last note I have, was, he mentioned Dennis [00:54:00] 10, who was the last, medalist from Kazakhstan at the world. Oh. And Mikhail said how he wished Dennis was still around to help him and to be able to ask him what this was like.
And everybody in this room full of very hardened reporters got choked up. Aw. Because it was just this sweet, genuine kid. Saying this very sweet, genuine sadness of losing probably his skating hero. Um, he was murdered in an attempted robbery when he was only 25. So skating lost something huge when Dennis 10 was killed.
But Mikel lost his, his guidance. Mm-hmm. In, in a way, you know, it’s not like Kazakhstan, I mean Yes. When it was part of the Soviet Union, but as its own independent country tennis. 10 is the reason Kazakhstan has a skating program. He brought the skaters [00:55:00] there. So that was just, and then Mikhail goes off in the exhibition and skates in a panda costume.
So there’s nothing this kid can do wrong in my eyes. And here’s something, this is, this is my last point. I know we’re, we’re doing a ridiculously long show, just about world championships, and this is gonna make you mad. They had the flags out down in the room where they repaired the costumes and, and got the kids ready, supposed to be steamed.
They didn’t steam them. Oh, you couldn’t see it on television. But in person, the second Japanese flag in the women’s and the Kazak flag looked like they had just taken it out of the package. Whoa. And even, you know, the flags that you were planning on seeing, like they knew there was gonna be a Japanese flag in American flag.
They weren’t steamed. Wow.
Jill Jaracz: Where was your steamers? We’re watching your Milans steaming [00:56:00] volunteer. Steam your flags any competition. Steam your flags. Steam your flags. It’s not that hard.
Alison Brown: I would’ve volunteered to do that. And it’s not like they steam the American flags and not the other, and you’re like, oh, they’re being, no, none of them.
Not just wrinkles, like the creases from being in the plastic packaging Honestly, that was the only sour note that, that the championships hit the whole week.
Jill Jaracz: Well that’s good. I’m so glad you got to go. I’m so, I’m so glad I
Alison Brown: got to go too. Now I can sleep.
TKFLASTANIs Alison met
Jill Jaracz: And you had attendees with Jackie Wong? I did. Jackie Wong is famous for having chicken attendees.
Alison Brown: I did get, he, we did not share the chicken tenders. We did not have them I don’t think at the same time. But I did get myself some chicken tenders and french fries for the last night, and I think Jackie won.
Was a little jealous of my chicken attendees.
Jill Jaracz: [00:57:00] And you got to meet Shuk Lesi, or a friend of the show. Ardi,
Alison Brown: I did meet Nick Ardi, and that’s always a, a joy to be actually a voice and not a a a rather to be a person and not in disembodied voice. He had a rough day, he had to do multiple assignments in the same day, but he made it just in time for the men’s.
So that was the men’s last group. So that was really good. got to meet Paul Edmonds. We were sitting and chatting at at various points. so not gonna argue about that. And I got a picture with Scott Hamilton, who could not have been lovelier. There
Jill Jaracz: you go.
Alison Brown: Excellent. And I survived a Terry truth, bara’s glare of death.
Jill Jaracz: You do not need to eat that cookie. You know, fatty. Fatty, I think I’m gonna go eat a cookie in her honor. I’m gonna go eat a cookie and it’s, we need to develop a cookie recipe. Just call it the eery or it’s a tooth bei.
Alison Brown: Would that have some, I don’t know, heart medication in it?
Jill Jaracz: Little powders sprinkled on [00:58:00] top.
Alison Brown: So thank you ISU for being, I don’t know, crazy enough to give me credentials for this event.
Coming soon – Get in touch!
Jill Jaracz: Excellent. Well, we are in good preview mode for Milan Cortina. That will be great. So that is going to do it for this episode. Let us know what you think the competition will be like for figure skating at Milan Cortina.
Alison Brown: And we do love hearing from you. You can chat with us and our other listeners on our Facebook group. Keep The Flame Alive Podcast. You can email us at Flame Alive pod@gmail.com. And the voicemail and text line is always open at 2 0 8 3 5 2 6 3 4 8. That’s 2 0 8 flame it. And this week if you want more Olympics and Paralympics, especially on figure skating, you can sign up for the newsletter@flamelivepod.com and we’ll have a link to that in the show notes.
Jill Jaracz: Later this week, we’ll be our normal episode date. We are going to do what we were supposed to do [00:59:00] last week and take a look at the new IOC President Kirsty Coventry, her background and how we think she’s going to shape the Olympics over the next eight years. So thank you so much for listening and wait.
What I forgot to
Alison Brown: thank Julie in the bar. Thanks Julie. In the bar at the TD Garden.
Jill Jaracz: Alright, thank you. And thank you listeners so much for listening and until next time, keep the flame alive.