Book Club Claire is back for our first selection of 2025, which is by a TKFLASTANI! We’re reading Beyond Expectations: An Extraordinary Equestrian Journey from Deadly Diagnosis to the Paralympic Games by Sydney Collier with Heather Wallace.
For Sydney Collier, a routine eye exam turned into a diagnosis of a life-threatening rare disease. She’s defied all expectations–particularly in terms of lifespan–to become a Paralympian in para dressage.
In her memoir, Sydney talks about how she was an eventer before her diagnosis, and that activity pretty much stopped. However, you can’t keep a horse person down.
A trip to an equestrian competition introduced Sydney to the world of para dressage. The rest would be history, but her quest to become a Paralympian involved a lot of travel and a lot of different horses to compete with.
Sydney overcame some pretty touch obstacles to earn her ticket to Rio 2016, but competing on the world’s biggest stage wasn’t enough….in an “you can’t dream this up moment,” Sydney found herself dancing with the president of Azerbaijan.
We discuss the book and Sydney’s unique journey and insight, which inspires us to be our own people.
Follow Book Club Claire and Sydney Collier on Insta!
Also on this episode, a Paris 2024 bullying case goes to trial, lots of news from Milan-Cortina 2026, and the International Olympic Committee has elected a new president! We have our initial thoughts on the new boss of the Olympics.
Thanks so much for listening, and until next time, keep the flame alive!
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TRANSCRIPT
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383-Book Club Claire on Beyond Expectations
Jill Jaracz: [00:00:00] Hello, and welcome to another episode of Keep the Flame Alive, the podcast for fans of the Olympics and Paralympics. If you love the games, we have the show for you. I am your host, Jill Jaracz, joined as always by my lovely co host, Alison Brown. Alison, hello, how are you?
Alison Brown: I am a little shocked today.
Jill Jaracz: I know. It’s been an exciting day. you know, we normally tape on Wednesdays and today uh, we taped on Thursday because it’s the day of the IOC presidential vote and it’s a shocker.
Alison Brown: We’re only about an hour out, so we are, we are fresh on this one.
Jill Jaracz: [00:01:00] Yeah, so it’s been a very exciting day. It’s been, it’s been a crazy couple of weeks.
I will say that for me. Uh, I’m coming to you from Northwest Indiana, from my childhood bedroom, where I will be for an undetermined amount of time, because my mom had unexpected, I was going to be here for some expected eye surgery, and, uh, she ended up in the hospital with some unexpected problems with their heart. So, uh, yeah, I’m here for a while. And, uh, it’ll, it’ll be fun trying to do the show from my bedroom.
Alison Brown: Well, we are nothing if not flexible. I mean, we’ve done it from hotel rooms. We’ve been in closets. I remember one time you had an ironing board as a desk.
Jill Jaracz: Yes.
Alison Brown: as always, we make it work and very, very speedy recovery to Margeris. I think I can speak for everyone and say, hang in there, both of you.
Jill Jaracz: So she’s doing all right. She’s making some progress and that is good. yes, we did have the IOC presidential vote today. [00:02:00] big, big exciting news on who is going to be TBAC’s successor. And, uh, we will get to that in our IOC news section.
Book Club Conversation: “Beyond Expectations” by Sydney Collier
Jill Jaracz: But first we have Book Club today. And I find it ironic that, we are talking about, uh, Sydney Collier’s, , book, Beyond Expectations, An Extraordinary Equestrian Journey from Deadly Diagnosis to the Paralympic Games, which, uh, Sydney wrote with Heather Wallace.
And, Sydney was a normal kid and one day had trouble seeing the blackboard and what was supposed to be a routine visit to the eye doctor turned into a diagnosis of Weyburn Mason syndrome, a life threatening condition that causes arteries and veins to grow together and causes vascular malformations in the brain.
I kind of feel like her parents when they went to the eye doctor and ended up in the hospital. it’s kind of an interesting parallel. So, uh, Book Club Claire is here to chat with us about the book, take a listen to our conversation about Beyond [00:03:00] Expectations.
Claire, welcome back. We are talking Beyond Expectations, Defying All Odds in Pursuit of a Lifelong Dream by Sydney Collier and Heather Wallace. Sydney is a Shuklastani, our para dressage writer, so we are really excited to read her book. What do you got for us, Claire?
Claire Natsis: I have a nice short little fun read that can definitely be, uh, said that it was written by a 20 something, , with her own unique style, which I don’t think we’ve gotten yet. So I kind of wanted to know your thoughts about that.
Alison Brown: It was fun for me because I heard Sydney in my head, having met her and spoken to her and, and kept up with her since we spoke to her.
It was fun because it felt like I was talking to her again. And hearing the background and the pieces and so much we didn’t know about how she got to where she was when we met her. So that was a lot of fun and it was a nice little read and a happy ending, which we don’t always get.
Jill Jaracz: Right.
And well, I will agree that it’s [00:04:00] a fun read and it’s definitely Sydney’s voice. It is published by
Trafalgar Square, which is kind of a horse focused press and so what I really liked about that was we got a lot of horsey stuff and I really understood horse people better. I mean, I know horse people are horse people, but horse people. are, there’s something special with the people who really love horses and the bond between human and horse and that really came through in this book.
Claire Natsis: Yeah, none of us
Alison Brown: are horse girls.
Claire Natsis: No, I’m definitely not. I’m one, I am probably the person on this podcast that wants equestrian off of the Olympic roster completely and Paralympic roster, just because I think that it would save so much money and stress. so reading this was interesting cause it did open up my eyes.
It also opened up my eyes that she grew up right next to me. she grew up in Ann Arbor. The Ann Arbor area and that’s where my family was [00:05:00] for many years. So the fact that she was just north of us was kind of cool to hear about. And apparently she went to skyline high school, whether that was in person or online, because of all the stuff that she was doing, but that was impressive for me.
I’m looking at the ghost writer. Her website is called timid rider. com. So I’m sure that she also has experience with horses and that explains a lot because when she is bringing in her. Knowledge of equestrian, it really does come through and it is easy like for someone like me who knows nothing about horses to understand.
I did like this book. I think I enjoyed when she got a little more goofy. dancing with the president of Azerbaijan. and not realizing it and some of, some of the fun quirks that she had. And I, I did enjoy the fact that Heather Wallace, it didn’t seem like her hand was in too much of the book.
Sometimes you can kind of tell when a ghostwriter is taking over, but I didn’t sense it that much when I was reading Sydney’s book. So that was nice. What was the part of the story for [00:06:00] Sydney that you did not know that kind of surprised you the most?
Alison Brown: I didn’t realize that so much of her disability was based not on the disorder she was born with, but the strokes.
Because, you know, we don’t ask a lot of questions when we, we talk to the athletes, especially the para athletes, about kind of how they got to where they were, and I knew she had had strokes, and I didn’t realize how unaware they were. Of what was going to happen for such a long period of her childhood, you know, she goes to this eye doctor appointment.
I think she was seven or eight. And oh, by the way, you have this, you know, she thinks, Oh, I just can’t see the board in school. And then her entire life changed from this eye doctor appointment. And I don’t think I understood kind of how dramatic her life took a new course throughout her childhood.
Jill Jaracz: I don’t think I realized how [00:07:00] compressed her para dressage riding career was from first getting on the horse again and getting into dressage to the Paralympics in Rio.
Didn’t realize she was going through so much so quickly and I think in a way that affected her in terms of growing up there’s a lot near the end where she’s reflecting back on who she was because now almost 10 years have passed and You can see some self reflection and some growth but when you think about a teenager Who is living far beyond anyone’s predictions because of her syndrome and is going through continually Debilitating strokes how that all works together and she still gets through the top there.
There’s a lot of grit there and a lot of determination
Claire Natsis: Definitely. And I did read, uh, listen to your podcast with her from 2021. I want to say it was April [00:08:00] and, her kind of gearing up for, her bid for the Tokyo games. And I was surprised at how little was mentioned about what I had read. I had read about, um, Half of the book by the time I listened to the podcast episode again, and I went, wow, there was a lot that they didn’t cover.
They just went and like Alison said, we went, they went straight into the dressage portion of it. and her life was tough for those, what? 10 years, from like seven to 17 where it’s strokes and, the disease that she has and everything like that. So a lot of that was surprising to me. was there a part of her life, like in her life that kind of stuck out for you besides Rio?
Jill Jaracz: Okay, this is where I, this is where I have some faults with the book because I couldn’t understand competitive life very well. We went from competition to competition. I didn’t understand. what horse she was riding. The catch [00:09:00] horse thing was interesting because she didn’t own a horse at the time. So in order to do competitions, she did ride something called the catch horse, which was kind of like whatever horse was available.
And that’s allowed in para dressage, not necessarily on able bodied riding. And so that was really interesting to learn about, but I got confused with the Going all over the country and riding all these different horses whom we all got introduced to because it’s a very horsey book and that was fine and interesting because you learned how different breeds of horses acted.
But then I didn’t understand her qualifying for the World Equestrian Games and then I didn’t understand necessarily the steps that it got to the Paralympics. I just got kind of lost in that section.
Alison Brown: I guess I kind of let that gloss over me in a way, just kind of flow over me because I agree. I was definitely confused because she was saying she needed points, which we’ve heard before in different sports, [00:10:00] but how that was all working. And I agree the catch writing was amazing. Like, how do you get on a horse?
You don’t know, you know, we talk about this in modern pentathlon, but this is a whole other level because this is para and a side of her body doesn’t. work in the same way as an able bodied rider. And the horse has to ignore certain physical gestures of hers, that those aren’t messages to the horse. So these horses, the way that they’re trained and the, and the relationship is so, special and skilled.
The one part of the competition section that I couldn’t get out of my head was when she was at the competition and the trainer was on drugs. I don’t know if that was what she thought or what she discovered later, but that the trainer just didn’t show up and she was having to handle the tasks of the trainer and the horse wasn’t being cared for properly.
And it reminded me every time we talk to an athlete, the athlete will always [00:11:00] credit their team, you know, whether it be their family or, You know, whoever their supporters or their coach, but there’s always these people who wax the skis or take care of the horse or, you know, set up your training plan, all these people that come into play.
And obviously with para athletes, there’s a lot more people involved. you know, all the physical therapists and, and the adaptive equipment people. And that’s the trainers just like, Oh yeah. And the way that Sydney kind of threw it out there, like, Oh yeah, we found out that this trainer had a drug problem and it was such a young person way to say it.
You know, like I, as an old lady would be like, You would not believe what happened. We found this whole thing. And like, give you the whole background. She’s like, oh yeah, he was on drugs. Then we got somebody else and it was fine. I loved that young voice coming through. You know, her voice coming through in that section.
Claire Natsis: At the same time, I’m sure she didn’t want to make it a big deal. She doesn’t mention the person by [00:12:00] name. So, you know, all those kinds of things. Don’t get sued. Yeah, exactly. Or it’s a small world. So, yeah, definitely. I think the thing that got me the most, was kind of talking about the personalities of the horses.
I thought that was really cute how, you know, even the pony that she started with all the way up there. To, the horses that she rode on her journey to Rio. each one was kind of different in their own way. she never put down any of the horses. she just kind of said, Oh, they have all, they all have their own quirks and stuff.
And that, I think we were, we were discussing how, you know, this is definitely a horsey book and. You could definitely tell, you know, a horse person is writing this because they are allowing a lot of their knowledge of these animals, these massive animals, which scare me to death, to come through, and I thought that was, that was really cool of her to do that.
Did you find any interest in, the family [00:13:00] life that she was talking about? She talked a lot about her mom who was traveling with her, a little bit about the quirks of her dad. did any of those stick out to you at all?
Alison Brown: I can’t remember what book we read, but I remember saying, I wish they had written it jointly with his wife.
And I almost wish I had gotten a section of this from her mother, because I’m so curious, because as, as a mother myself, I know that taking your kid to the eye doctor, taking your kids to the hospital. And from the child’s perspective is one thing, and clearly her parents did a lot to protect her from.
Some really horrible things that were probably happening behind the scenes and the conversations that were happening. And I’m so curious what both of her parents, you know, given that they have such different personalities were going through. I mean, taking your kid to that cyber knife treatment. I can’t, I can’t imagine that.
I cannot imagine what that must [00:14:00] have been like where you’re just sitting there and then you’ve got two other kids. She had two brothers who You know, there’s a whole phenomenon called the glass child, where the siblings of a child with disabilities or with medical issues, and you have to protect them in a very special way.
So I kind of wish we had, I mean, it’s not their book, but I would love to talk to them and say, okay, let’s have a cup of tea and now tell me what that was like when you’re just sitting in the waiting room during that cyber knife treatment.
Jill Jaracz: I agree. I’ve especially in the beginning when we’re getting a lot about, and treatment of Wyburn Mason syndrome.
And because Sydney is so young, we only I don’t know if what memories are there or you know if she is out of it for part of her treatment What does she know and what does she have to piece together to tell us this story? And I really wanted her mom’s perspective her dad’s perspective as well to flesh out that story a [00:15:00] little bit and to give it a little bit more I also I wondered what happened with the Wyvern Mason.
I know she’s living with it, but she says at the end she’s the only one living with the syndrome. And usually it means death at a very, very young age. And once we get past the Cyberknife treatment, we get word of strokes here and there, and that’s what’s causing more debilitation, but we don’t really touch back on the Wyburn Mason at all.
And one would think that maybe she would be tracked or that the doctors in Stanford who, who did her treatments would be really following her closely to understand this disease. And I think that’s a thread of the book that we kind of lose. And in a way that’s important. Because rare diseases like this, when nobody has the disease, there’s no money for it.
So to kind of keep promoting the syndrome, I think that does a [00:16:00] disservice in a way to the entire story.
Alison Brown: Almost like we needed an epilogue from the Stanford people.
Jill Jaracz: We needed a lot of epilogues, let me tell you. I, and I get that we want to end on a high with Rio, but the book was written in 2024 and we lose out
and she does talk about post Rio starting to train for Tokyo or go for Tokyo, but we don’t get any of that story and I know that’s a down note to end on and we don’t necessarily want to do that, but you kind of wonder what What happened and what’s next because we’re left with so much hope but that hope kind of ends in 2017 2018 2019 and then what’s happened and maybe that’s a different maybe that’s a different book because we don’t know the end of that story But there’s something missing here in a way for me at least and maybe that’s where this one ends [00:17:00] and that’s That’s all of her life.
She wants to share
Alison Brown: She hasn’t had enough time yet to reflect on those years. Yeah. You know, it could be she is young and ten years, you know, we were saying there’s this ten year period of where all these things happen and ten years from now, will she be able to then go back to this portion, that 2018 forward?
Jill Jaracz: True. And that’s it. I wish we didn’t go to Tokyo or mention Tokyo at all and just ended with that section.
Alison Brown: Though I wonder if our knowledge of that section Ruins it for us
Claire Natsis: right because you interviewed her in April of 21 right before the qualifications for for Tokyo So I would definitely see that when it comes to her family I have to give them a lot of credit because to be an equestrian parents It seems to require a lot of money and time.
Like, like there are, there are football parents and baseball parents where you’re going on travel teams and you have to wake up at the crack of [00:18:00] dawn on a Saturday morning for an all day tournament and then you don’t get back until late and practices and all this. And equestrian is like times a million.
Because not, you also have to deal with a giant animal, for the most part. And so, especially her mother, who took on a lot of the, the duties of getting her to New York, and sometimes they were in Texas, and sometimes they were in Florida, and there was a lot of that going on. So it was, it was interesting to, to see how.
Her mother dealt with that. Her father at some points, her father making the offhand comments sounds a lot like my dad, you know, kind of ill timed comments. It’s like, this is probably, you know, those, those dads, dads are just like that, I guess. you know, by the way, your great grandma just died. It’s like, wait, what?
I appreciated the two of them for, for sticking together and for supporting her, even through all of her medical stuff. to come together and say, well, we are still going to allow you to take part in your dream of, [00:19:00] of riding horses, and, and make sure that you can, you can achieve that goal. So a lot of credit to them for sure.
They also, I mean, if you look at pictures of Sydney. I mean, she’s got, she had a nose piercing. Her hair is always different colors. So they really allow her to be the free spirit and that does emote in the book itself as well. I also appreciated that. when I listened to the podcast, I don’t think you guys covered Rio a whole lot.
Was there anything in the book that surprised you about her Rio experience?
Alison Brown: I thought it was interesting. It actually was in the very beginning of the book when she talked about fighting with the officials to be allowed to walk the arena because because of her vision, she needs to count paces and things like that.
She can’t just look at an arena and get that absorbed. And What was interesting to me is so many times when we talk to Paralympians and Parathletes, they’re fighting with officials. And I’m thinking, you’re a Paralympic official. Could you be a little more flexible? It’s like you’re [00:20:00] dealing with people with multiple different abilities and disabilities.
And the whole point of the Paralympics is to show how high level these people can compete at. but you have to be flexible. You have to use a running blade or you have to use a, an adaptive aid. And that seemed like such a simple thing to be allowed to do. And yet she’s fighting with the officials until the last minute to just be able to walk the arena.
Jill Jaracz: Yeah, I agree that that bit was a surprise for me as well. And I wonder how many of the officials came from. the Equestrian Federation versus did you have local people that they hired or had volunteers to go through this and what’s going on in the local organizations mindset versus what needed to happen to give everybody a fair shake.
Alison Brown: Yeah, I would expect, dressage people are [00:21:00] very strict. in protocol. It’s one of those sports, right? I mean, all officials are strict. That’s their point to keep it, to keep the rules. But I would think dressage people are even. I would love to hang out with them.
Claire Natsis: I, I would, I can see your points for sure when it, and we’ve all had experiences now with the media, at a games since you’ve both went to Paris on media credentials and as well as Beijing, you kind of see where the locals come into play, the, how the volunteers come, you both have seen rising Phoenix, the Paralympics, which covers both London and Rio, and we know that Rio.
Paralympics was very like, is this even going to happen because there was such bad organization. So how much of that came into play with it? And by the way, if, if you have not listeners, if you have not seen rising Phoenix, it’s on Netflix, his documentary, please watch it because it is phenomenal. Um, I think you guys talked about it [00:22:00] many years ago, but
Jill Jaracz: totally agree with you
Alison Brown: and features another Sukhvastani, Matt Stutzman, and where I absolutely fell in love with him watching that movie.
So, yeah, we were like, after we saw that, we’re like, Matt needs to be on the show.
Claire Natsis: Yes, for sure. And, um. I really enjoyed hearing her perspective on Rio because it’s, it was a very interesting Olympics to watch, uh, from afar and to, to get the Paralympic experience and see how much she enjoyed it, how much she enjoyed, you know, all the free stuff.
She, she, of course she would mention all the cool free stuff, which I was very curious about and the duffle bags of stuff and how she. Went through processing and didn’t realize she should only try on like one thing of each. She wanted to try on everything and they kind of knocked on her door and said, Sydney, you have to go.
So I, I enjoyed that. it was, it was good to hear. I, I was sad because again, you guys talked to her coming up to, to Tokyo, to the book talked about that, but she did not end up going to Tokyo for the [00:23:00] Paralympics nor Paris. so I am kind of, I did not do my due diligence and follow up. As to what’s happening with her now on her website, it still has her with all in one, the horse that she was with when she was interviewed by you.
but I don’t know how up to date that is, with all the stuff that’s happened in the past seven or eight years, but it is something where I hope she’s doing well. And I hope that she’s still riding in some way, although it does seem like she’s doing a lot of public speaking as well.
Alison Brown: Before we get off what you were just saying, I love how no matter how big of a star these athletes are that we talk to, they all love processing and they all love talking about processing and, know, Simone Biles and the basketball stars in Paris, they still were showing all the cool stuff they got.
I don’t think that ever gets old for any of these athletes, which I love. All of a sudden they’re kids in candy stores and they’re like, Oh, look, we got. New Nike socks. And I,
Claire Natsis: I love that. Well, if Team USA wants to really do a great [00:24:00] promotional campaign, they should have a lucky winner that gets to go through processing and follow them through.
Just a random person. And they get to do all the processing stuff. They get to be, they get to be on the Instagram story or YouTube thing. You know how much fun that would be? Yeah, I would totally do that. Hey, Team USA, if you need somebody, I’m, I’ll give you my number.
Alison Brown: I was going to say, or they could send a couple of old lady podcasters through.
Jill Jaracz: So I am, I’m casually looking up what is going on with Sydney. One thing I forgot to mention, because it’s on the back of the book, she’s in a documentary called Para Gold that came out in 2022. And I really wanted to when I flipped over the book after I was done reading it and like we didn’t hear anything about that either and and maybe at some point you had to stop, stop writing, but, she is still riding four to four to five times a week. So she is still out there in the saddle.
Claire Natsis: And she does [00:25:00] not have journey anymore. Journey has passed on. He crossed the rainbow bridge, but, her new service dog, his name is Logan. And it’s also a poodle, which I had to laugh because that was like the one dog that she didn’t want.
She’s like, as long as it’s not a poodle, it ended up being a poodle, but,
Alison Brown: and she’s actually. training a dog to replace Logan.
Claire Natsis: Aww.
Alison Brown: Now they gotta, uh, I want to say in a matter of months, there is a new dog being that Logan, cause I guess at some point the dog becomes too old to do the job, they get to retire.
So Logan and the puppy are working with her right now. This is a girl who loves animals and animals love her. I love all the pictures where the dog is in the picture, the horse is in the picture. It’s like, oh, you can always trust a girl if animals love her. And that’s, that’s the nice thing about I think that really comes through in this book is how much she loves the horses and the horses love her.
And that I love [00:26:00] about this because that I think is something that came through to us when, when we spoke to her is how much Sidney just loves the horses.
Claire Natsis: And something that might not have come through in any of the other books, I don’t think we’ve had books with, uh, service animals, but how hard it is to bring them overseas to different countries because certain countries will not allow, you know, an animal period because for, I believe it was Azerbaijan, they kind of trained them to be more defensive than anything else.
and aggressive. And so when they saw Journey and was very surprised by this docile, subservient dog that was helping, they didn’t even send Journey to Brazil because they were too nervous about the, the quarantining restrictions. So it was good to get those kinds of, pieces of information for sure.
final thoughts on the book before we wrap it up?
Jill Jaracz: Okay. I’m gonna be a little bit of a Debbie Downer. I enjoyed this book. I think it’s a good read. I did think there was a lot of telling without showing. There was a [00:27:00] lot of, I have to pay tribute to people, so let me shove something in there, about paying tribute to different people in my life who have been there for me.
and, and, I think there were missed opportunities. The way she talks about her mentor, Jonathan comes through at times, but that’s not what was things aren’t woven into the book into the full story as well as I hoped they would be woven into the full story. Jonathan comes. He’s a mentor. He’s very important to her.
They work on getting dressage into, a bigger competition, but by that point, I believe Jonathan had passed away if I remember correctly. But we didn’t learn anything about that work that they were doing together. There was just a lot of Jonathan’s my mentor. He’s so important to me. This has happened.
They are so important to me. We didn’t have the money. Well, I never understood what mom and dad did for a living to put that into context of, I know [00:28:00] equestrian is super expensive, but every time she said, Oh, that was too much. Well, we, we only heard like, Oh, I had to fly spirit airlines again. And Really useful details like that showing us. Oh, we have to get we have to deal with Packed planes and trying to fit a dog on and all these other hassles Instead of instead of telling us that I think that is really where parts of the book didn’t work for me as well
Alison Brown: Sydney has every right given what she has been through to be an absolutely horrible person and she’s not And she is so joyful and so lovely and very funny and so self deprecating and it just makes me, I absolutely agree there are, there are missed opportunities in the book. It was a lot of fun to read this and get that joy from her and seeing how [00:29:00] tough things had been.
And to remind myself to say, you know what, lots of horrible things happen to a lot of people. And you can take it a lot of ways and the way that she has made her life what it is is a testament to her and to her family and to all of their resilience and best of all, I have a very great new phrase involving a pretzel that I can’t say on the show that I have already yelled out in the kitchen during a rather disastrous.
escapade with some sourdough starter. So, for that alone, I am grateful for this book.
Jill Jaracz: And I will say, I will say, this was also a great reminder of how, you know, extroverted she is, and I am not as, nearly as extroverted, but like, that personality trait. I think helps so much and getting to know other people and [00:30:00] getting through a lot of stuff.
Obviously, she went through a pretty dark time in dealing with traditional school. We kind of get a glimpse of that. Her personality really helps her get through a lot. And I think that’s a testament to like making choices and just being who you are and sticking with your guns. it can. Be a lifeline.
Claire Natsis: Definitely. I think, I don’t see a lot of those flaws in the book just because it made it an easy read for me. If you want a nice little, short book that only takes you a couple days, couple sittings to read, this is a very good book for that. If you don’t want a deep dive, if you don’t want a 500 page book all about it, because I’m sure she could have expanded the, the, the, what, 20 years that we got from her into 500 pages because she dealt with so much.
but it’s just, you know, a nice little book to, to tell you the story and for you to maybe investigate your own and [00:31:00] These people endure a lot of difficulties and hardships, and we are made more aware of it through these books, so I appreciated that, for sure.
Jill Jaracz: Excellent, Claire. Yeah, that wraps it up. What’s on tap for our next selection?
Claire Natsis: We are going to be going back to Athens 2004, so a few years ago, 21 years ago, don’t remind me. Oh, shush! Oh my gosh! back when I was a freshman in college and right there, okay. Um, we’re going to be looking at pole vault, so track and field.
So I’m super excited about that. The book is about Tim Mack, the pole vaulter, and the title of the book is called Above and Beyond Tim Mack, the Pole Vault, and the Quest for Olympic Gold, and it is written by Bill Livingston. So I’m seeing it on my Kindle library, so it’s definitely something you can find there, or it’s probably on the bookshop site if you want to use the affiliate.
and you’ll find it a bunch of different [00:32:00] places and I’m curious to see what this guy’s all about because I’ve heard the name, but I don’t know his story at all.
Jill Jaracz: Excellent. I am looking forward to that as well. He is from the Cleveland area. So we will look on Cleveland jumpers. My goodness. What’s happening there?
We got pole vault in the blood. You got a vault over that river. To get to the other side of the city.
Claire Natsis: The river that’s on fire, you
Jill Jaracz: mean? Yes, exactly, exactly. All right, Claire. Thank you so much, and we will talk to you next time. See you then. Thank you so much, Claire. You can follow Claire on Insta at cnattravels. We’ll have a link to that in the show notes. Also, you can follow, uh, Sydney on, uh, Insta at Sid’s Paraquest. Did you see her sleeve tattoo?
Alison Brown: I have not. I will pull that up when we come up. But is it impressive? Of course, it’s impressive.
Oh, it’s
Jill Jaracz: amazing. It is so detailed. It’s got her first dog and one of her [00:33:00] horses. in there. I know.
Alison Brown: Everything she does is, is kind of amazing. She’s, I mean, we, we spoke to her and we’ve texted with her and she’s just a really wonderful person. So that, that makes it very easy to like her.
Jill Jaracz: She is and a great spokesperson for rare diseases as well, as well as being a an advocate for more Paraquestrian, which is a lot of fun to watch.
I will say that. Uh, you can get your copy of Beyond Expectations from our bookshop. org storefront. We have it featured on our book club list at the top of our page. That is bookshop. org slash shop, slash flame alive pod. Anytime you make a purchase through our bookshop. org affiliate link, you help independent bookstores and also very importantly, this independent podcast, because we earn a commission off of any purchase made through our link.
If you are in the market for books, please go to bookshop. org slash shop slash flame alive pod today.
Paris 2024 News
Alison Brown: Oh, mon dieu.
Jill Jaracz: remember how, Thomas Jolie, the, artistic director for the ceremonies for the Paris Olympics got a lot of death threats and complaints about his work. Well, there are seven people now charged in connection with alleged cyberbullying against Thomas Jolly.
Uh, he got a number of death threats and, homophobic and anti Semitic abuse on social. The Associated Press reported that the seven people uh, range in age from 22 to 79.
Come on, you’re old enough to know better. That’s what I think. the allegations carry the weight of potential prison time and heavy fines. So we will have a verdict at the later, at a later date. Good.
Alison Brown: You know, a lot of athletes during the Olympics and Paralympics dealt with a lot of cyber bullying.
And we’ll have to do, I really want to do a show on that as well as what’s been happening. But good. [00:35:00] Good. I mean, why do you think that this is okay? Because you didn’t like a show. You’re going to, you’re going to threaten somebody with death. There’s a human being on the other side of that phone. Calm down.
Jill Jaracz: Right, yeah, death, you know, I don’t like it to death. It’s a pretty big leap
Alison Brown: I know we have a clean rating, but can I say FAFO? Ah,
Milan-Cortina 2026 News
Jill Jaracz: buongiorno! Buongiorno! We have a bunch of news from Milan Cortina. First off, The American ABC has reported that the bobsled track is ready for testing. The structure was finished on time on March 16th. Uh, the ice is being laid.
It will be finished on Sunday.
On Monday the 24th, there will be 60 bobsled, luge, and skeleton athletes to start the testing. And then another interesting tidbit that they had was that the Cortina Athletes Village is also going [00:36:00] up this month, and they will be living in prefab mobile homes.
It’s a temporary village, and they will house up to 1, 400 athletes.
Alison Brown: Hopefully the wallpaper won’t be stuck up with tape, like it was in the Beijing Mountain.
Jill Jaracz: Hopefully the walls won’t be stuck up with tape.
Alison Brown: Well, no, the, and we’re going to talk more about the IOC, report, but Milan Cortina’s report said that the sliding track is in good shape and was, it wasn’t just the organizer saying that, it was the IOC members taking a look at that.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, good.
Alison Brown: So, it looks like we may, should I jinx it?
Jill Jaracz: No, they did, I did see a little bit of the Milan Cortina, report from the IOC session. I’m a little bit behind on my session watching. They did say that hockey arena has a very tight timeline, but they are confident they will get it done. That’s something else to keep an eye on.
Other news from Milan Cortina, the torches will be announced and released on. April [00:37:00] 14th, so that is coming up very soon. So we’re getting one step closer to all the stuff happening.
Alison Brown: Okay, so I want to just make a quick hopeful prediction. I want it to look like an icicle. Ooh. I know they can’t change it now because that’s a brilliant idea, but like pointy and like Crystally looking that would be kind of in that Everything is kind of futuristic With the Milan design, so I want it to look like an icicle.
That would be cool. And if not, Salt Lake City, French Alps. Take my idea. I won’t even copyright it though. I would like a little, a little of the funds if you don’t mind.
Jill Jaracz: Back to construction news, the ice works that they’ve been building in Milan, I guess the permanent works are complete and they are very excited to show how you could do speed skating in a temporary venue.
So that’ll be interesting because they weren’t going [00:38:00] to build a permanent speed skating track, which on the one hand is good because it’s expensive. On the other hand, you don’t have a track for, you don’t have a track to attract new athletes. So, you know, where are they going to train if they want to get into the sport?
but budget’s a concern these days. It’s really, it really is. So I’ll be interested to see how temporary facilities play a part in that.
LA 2028 News
Alison Brown: L. A. has been on my brain this week because I’ve been writing about all kinds of things with L. A. So, the big one! Boxing is back. Boxing is back. So the IOC executive board gave provisional approval to putting boxing back on the program. Mostly because the new federate, the new international federation, World Boxing, got [00:39:00] enough countries to join up and leave IBA, formerly IEBA, which is in all kinds of trouble.
So I think we’re going to see boxing in L. A.
Jill Jaracz: I’m glad for the athletes. Exactly. That’s for sure. And I’m, I’m glad that, they’ve got something more stable and hopefully this is going to be a more permanent fix. We shall see about that. But, looking forward to having boxing competition. I don’t know if LA has to organize it. I’m hoping World Boxing has to organize it.
Alison Brown: No, the, the plan is because World Boxing was given the provisional approval as the International Federation that they will be organizing the tournament. Cause that was why it was kicked off. Cause the IOC is like, we’re not doing this again. We have a big enough party to plan, do your own, boxing tournament.
So World Boxing is going to put it together because they’ve got countries now on five continents, which is kind of one of the, um, the requirements from the IOC to get recognized as the International [00:40:00] Federation.
Brisbane 2032 News
Jill Jaracz: little bit of news from Brisbane, Tennis Australia would like Brisbane 2032 to renovate the tennis facilities in the area and they, they say it’s going to cost 113 million. And if. If it doesn’t happen, they might move the tennis competitions to Melbourne.
Alison Brown: How far is Melbourne from Brisbane?
Jill Jaracz: Long way.
That’s what I thought. Because, Sydney to Melbourne is,
somebody’s going to yell at me if I’m wrong, but, that is a few days drive because I have done it. Yeah.
Alison Brown: Oh, okay.
Jill Jaracz: It’s a big, it’s a big country.
Alison Brown: I know it’s a big country, which is why I asked the question. Yeah. Oh, okay. So this is, this is not ideal.
Jill Jaracz: No, no, not at all. we shall see because, uh, that’s part of the, 100 Day Brisbane [00:41:00] 2032 Infrastructure Review.
So we will dig into that a little bit as well in the coming week and, uh, see what else we can find out there. but know that there’s gonna be, uh, some issues over facilities for 2032. It makes me wonder, and, and we’ll talk about this next week too, because we’re going to talk about, T Box
term as president and what he’s accomplished and the changes that have, and what he hasn’t accomplished and the changes that have been made. And this is why I keep coming back to, I, Australia is a great games host, but was it wise to award 2032? So early,
Alison Brown: You know, people are, are questioning awarding L. A. 28 as early as they did now because of issues that have come up. So maybe this will be that, that the new system that they put in, for awarding the games. Didn’t work as well as they’d hoped, but again, you’re kind of always fighting the last war, you know They were running into the [00:42:00] problem of not having host cities.
Right. So what do you do?
You elect a new president is what you do. I see
Jill Jaracz: new IFC president elected just a couple hours before we started recording. We had seven candidates So you imagine that this process is going to take a while because the voting process is one person has to get the majority and if there’s no majority, they start whittling out the least vote getters.
We got this done in one round of voting, shocking everybody and our new IOC president. It’s Kirsty Coventry. Get used to saying Madam President. That or KCo.
Alison Brown: I was wondering what we were going to come up with. So, first woman, first African, she is from Zimbabwe. Youngest since Pierre de Couperin, I mean, this was a [00:43:00] surprise, but not a shock or a shock, but not a surprise.
I mean, she was Teabox select. She was his pick.
Jill Jaracz: Yes. And, and of course, there’s going to be a lot of theories from journalists on how much he influenced the vote, but the, you needed 49. She got 49. The other 48 votes broke down. Second place was Juan Antonio Samaranch with 28, Sebco 8, David Lapartia with 4, Moriani Wontanabe with 4, Prince Faisal Al Hussein with 2, and Johann, Eliasech.
Alison Brown: ,
Kirsty Coventry, I mean, the top three were the top three. All the betting lines, everybody was talking about this. Samaranch Jr. has kind of come up at the end here and, and people were expecting him to do very well, possibly win. But getting it done in one vote really seemed to surprise everyone.
[00:44:00] And not the least of which was the IOC itself, because during the vote, they get the results. And then they just stopped. There was a lot of paper shuffling. There was a lot of confusion. I think everybody was really surprised that they were done.
Jill Jaracz: Right. Because it’s been, the process of the voting has been, compared to the conclave in the Vatican when you choose a new Pope and it was going to be a long drawn out ordeal and all of a sudden it’s done.
You’ve got Simon Burnton from The Guardian who is live blogging and who just doesn’t know what to do. He’s a little miffed about it being finished so quickly. And then he starts live blogging about the music that they’re playing. And it’s, it was just kind of one of those stereotypical sports journalist kind of moves that really annoyed me to be quite honest.
Was uncalled for but now we’re getting all [00:45:00] of the stories are coming out with The news and now we’ll Kirsty Coventry’s given a little interview afterwards and over the next week or so we’ll have a lot more details on behind the scenes if anybody any of the members will talk to the press and what’s happening on in the transition?
She won’t take Office until June, T Bach is going to stay on for a transition period. And I did read that, Bach wanted that to happen because when he came into office, there was no transition. And that really upset him. He had a lot of work to do to get up to speed. So it’ll be nice to have a little smoothing over and make this work.
I’m amazed. And kind of impressed. I mean, this is really a changing of the guard.
Alison Brown: I was hoping on the one hand, Kirsty Coventry would win because I think that signals from the IOC membership that they’re ready. They’re ready to make this generational change, to have a woman. is a big [00:46:00] deal in this organization.
We talk about the IOC not changing and it’s trying to turn the Titanic and to have this woman who is very accomplished as an athlete and even during her athletic career really got herself on athletes commissions and, and worked with the IOC and was part of Zimbabwe’s political structure in terms of, of minister of sport.
This is a very smart, very accomplished woman. And we all know that doesn’t necessarily mean you get a seat at the table. And they gave her the seat. And that is huge. And yes, in many ways she is a traditionalist like Bach, but optics matter. And to have a 41 year old woman standing up there makes a huge difference.
My favorite moment of the whole. process, besides the paper shuffling, was they’ve announced, Coventry. She’s walking up. Everyone’s hugging her. Everyone’s hugging her. And she’s about to step up to the podium, basically just to say her first little words. And she [00:47:00] has a moment where she looks at the podium and just sort of mouths, wow.
Like she realized the weight. Of this moment, which I don’t think we see enough of from some of these high ranking officials. I mean, the IOC moves countries in many ways, and that’s a big weight. And she recognizes that. And I’m, I’m excited to see what she’s going to do.
Jill Jaracz: I am too. And I agree with you on the changing of the guard.
In a way, it’s an element of relief because you, you’re just like, come on, can you please elect somebody who’s younger and move into the next generation of leadership, and then you’re worried that it’s not going to happen. Maybe it’s because in our country, we have an issue with transferring leadership to younger generations right now.
And it happened and you can see it can happen. And the IOC has worked to [00:48:00] really. imbue youth elements into the Olympic movement. So you’ve got the Youth Olympic Games, which was a Jacques Rogue project, which has continued. They didn’t stop it. And then all of the elements of adding urban sports and sports that would target youth better.
And now you have a younger president who is hopefully I’m Teabag wasn’t in touch. And maybe the IOC leadership being older that you saw that they wanted to change, but having this change happen is going to be a big
Alison Brown: deal. And there’s been a lot of push to expand in Africa. I mean, both doing the e sports in Saudi Arabia, the, is it the youth Olympic games that are going to be in Dakar?
So to have someone. Zimbabwean matters. So it’s very exciting. Okay. So we have a week because there’s going to be so much information, you know, in between the time we heard the announcement, you got the actual breakdown of the vote. So the news is coming fast and furious. We’re going to digest it. We’re going to deep dive.
[00:49:00] So if you have things you want us to deep dive specifically, let us know and we’re going to have, we’re going to have fun next week getting to talk about all this. Yes,
Jill Jaracz: yes, yes, yes.
Alison Brown: We love some inside baseball once in a while.
Jill Jaracz: Okay. Also, from the IOC, they have, made an agreement with Comcast NBCUniversal to extend media rights to, 2034 and 2036.
So that, agreement also includes a strategic partnership that goes beyond broadcast rights, which is going to be, building on Comcast’s expertise in technology and infrastructure to support the delivery of the games, support for in venue distribution of live TV coverage, uh, supporting OBS in the production of the Olympic video player.
Uh, there’s going to be a collaboration on digital advertising opportunities in the U S. that will be, uh, Also, Universal and the, the agreement includes NBC Universal and the Peacock streaming platform. [00:50:00] So this is pretty big deal.
Alison Brown: I hope this means that we will end up with more and better, because if OBS is working with Comcast, that they’re not going to have to duplicate anything, that they’re going to be able to do more.
Like remember, who was it we were talking to about, oh, it was Alexis, talking about that you can only have so many, cameras set up for live coverage, especially for Para. That was a big problem. So if you are not competing. as OBS and Comcast kind of were in the past, they would work together, but they were really competing.
If you’re doing more streamlined, can we then have more coverage?
Jill Jaracz: Maybe. That would be nice. Or their cameras share. Right. Kind of thing. So, uh, it’ll be good. Apparently this was a deal like a year in the making. So, pretty big deal. I also wonder if that means that some of the docu series that the OBS has [00:51:00] been a part of on Netflix, I wonder if those are gonna shift to Peacock at all.
Alison Brown: Oh. Oh, that means I have to get more Peacock. More streaming services.
Jill Jaracz: Yeah. That’s okay. We’ll see. No, not a done deal, but there’s something else to look out for.
Alison Brown: It’s a write off. It’s a write off.
Jill Jaracz: Also, Allianz has extended its top sponsorship with the IOC until 2032. That includes French Alps 2030 and Brisbane 2032.
During Paris 2024, Allianz had a medical assistance program for athletes, staff, volunteers, and members of the Olympic and Paralympic families. They provided ticket cancellation insurance for fans and delivered property and liability coverage for many sports venues. So a lot of stuff that you don’t necessarily see.
is what their, their sponsorship includes. Uh, but also nice that they have continued it. and also on the, the IOC session, Teabag elected honorary president for life.
Alison Brown: So we’re not [00:52:00] losing him. I’m so happy about that. He’ll still pop up from time to time. But you know what? I have a feeling for, Milan.
He’s going to be very under the radar because he’s going to want Kirsty Coventry to have her first moment, but maybe He’ll sneak in here and there and
Jill Jaracz: That would be nice.
Alison Brown: We’re like, who’s that little German man sitting there? Oh my goodness, it’s T Bach!
Jill Jaracz: You know what it’s gonna be? It’s gonna be another situation where a whole bunch of people are crowded trying to get into the same entrance and I will accidentally touch T Bach’s butt, like I touched Sergei Bubka’s butt.
Alison Brown: Please don’t do that. I’ll be, I’ll be trapped in an elevator. It’ll be an elevator situation. You know, I keep getting in elevators with people, like I was in an elevator with Oksana Masters. I’ve been in some elevators and I’ll be in the elevator with, with Teebok and Claudia. And, and I’ll be just like, I love your husband, he’s amazing, and I’ll do something totally inappropriate and they will just run out of that elevator.
Oh, [00:53:00] who is this crazy American?
TKFLASTAN News
Alison Brown: Welcome to Shookflastan.
Jill Jaracz: It is the time of the show where we check in with our team Keep the Flame Alive. These are guests, past guests and listeners of the show who make up the citizenship of our very own country, Shookflastan. We have results. Shookflastan. Shookflastan.
Alison Brown: So, results from the IBSF World Championships in Lake Placid, Shannon Galea finished 28th in Women’s Skeleton, Josh Williamson finished 9th in Two Man Bobsled with driver Christopher Horn, and 4th in Four Man with driver Frank Del Duca.
So, think he’s recovered from his surgery earlier last year. Adam Edelman finished 25th in two man bobsled and Brie Walker finished 13th in two man bobsled and 9th in monobob.
Jill Jaracz: And I’m so sorry for Brie because she was one of the top monobobbers this year and she was sick.
Alison Brown: She was very [00:54:00] sick the whole time.
It was questionable whether she would even compete. But she got out on the track and she fought through so good on you, Ray. I mean, that was no joke up in Lake Placid this week.
Jill Jaracz: Wheelchair Curler Steve Emt competed in the Wheelchair Curling Mixed Doubles Championships and got the U. S. a quota spot for Milan Cortina 2026.
Alison Brown: Dr. Sarah Gascon has been named head coach of the USA Senior Women’s Handball Team. Her first competition at the helm will be the World Championships in Mexico City. This also means I hope she’ll likely be sticking around for LA because the USA gets an automatic birth. I hope so. We may have to get her back on the show.
I know. We got to talk handball again. We haven’t talked to her since we were a different name.
Jill Jaracz: Para archer Matt Stutzman has been nominated for the Laureus Sportsperson of the Year with a disability. And snowboarder Chloe Kim has been nominated as Action Sportsperson of the [00:55:00] Year.
Alison Brown: Lee Kiefer has been inducted into the USA Fencing Hall of Fame class of 2025 with her hero, Mariel Sagunas.
So they’re going in together, I know. And Lee has also been nominated for an AAU Sullivan Award for the most exceptional collegiate or Olympic level athlete.
Jill Jaracz: Phil Andrews in USA Fencing combined with several other national governing bodies for certain functions. We’ll add this on to Next week’s show as well, because it’s really interesting.
There’s just a collective of sports that said we’re coming together to pool resources for marketing and and other elements to, hopefully be able to target. Better sponsors together than they would have individually because they can bring a bigger audience together.
Alison Brown: And Paralympic gold medalist Samantha Bosco got to design an LA 28 logo and her A includes a hummingbird.
Naturally. Uh, [00:56:00] did you see this? The logo? The
logo, yeah.
Oh yeah, I used the logo, her logo, in my Substack newsletter this week.
Jill Jaracz: Oh, excellent. It’s a good,
Alison Brown: oh, I’m so proud of this week. Beautiful. So proud of what I wrote this week, so.
Jill Jaracz: Okay, good on that.
If you haven’t got, if you don’t get our Substack, you should sign up at flamealivepod. com, go down to the bottom and there’s a sign up. or if you’re on Substack, just look for us at Keep the Flame Alive.
Kenny Bednarik will be competing at the first Grand Slam track meet at, in Kingston, Jamaica on April 4th through 6th.
He is racing short sprints for the racers team.
Alison Brown: And Samantha Schultz will be appearing at the USOPC Museum’s Spring Into Victory Week. She’ll be doing laser pistol demos on Tuesday, March 25th, Thursday, March 27th from 11 to 12 p. m. and on Saturday, March 29th from 11 a. m. to 1 p. m. I think that is very cool that she still does stuff with the museum.
Laser pistol demos! Do you think they would let me touch one of those because I [00:57:00] can’t hurt anybody?
Jill Jaracz: That’s true, and I would love to do laser pistols. I would love if the UIPM brought back its laser run series. Maybe it is, and I haven’t looked at it, but that is something on my list to try.
Get in Touch
Jill Jaracz: That’s going to do it for this episode.
Let us know what you thought of Beyond Expectations by Sidney Collier.
Alison Brown: And we do love hearing from you. You can chat with us and other listeners on our Facebook group, Keep the Flame Alive Podcast. Email us at flamealivepod at gmail. com and the voicemail and text line is always open at 208. 4 8. That’s 2 0 8 FLAME IT.
And as we mentioned before, you can find our newsletter on Substack. Sign up for that at flamealivepod. com. We’ll have a link to that in the show notes.
Coming Soon – Let us know what you think about the new IOC president!
Jill Jaracz: Next week we are going to do that deep dive on the new IOC president and look back on T Buck’s presidency. Yeah, get in on the Facebook group because it’s already Hoppin with, conversation about, Keiko’s presidency.[00:58:00]
I don’t know if that’ll stick or not, but I kind of like it. This is going to be the first change of leadership that we go through as a podcast. So we do want to know what you think of this change. Please get in touch via, like Alison said, an email, voicemail, Facebook group, and our other socials.
Thank you so much for listening. And until next time, keep the flame alive.